Which Spyder folder is the toughest; will take the most abuse?

[Pelagic]

I don't think anyone wants to bend a folder at the pivot laterally like that. I wouldn't even do that to a Cold Steel SR1 if the blade was made of s7.... at the end of the day, a folder is a folder. And what is shown in that video would even be abuse of a hammer or prybar, let alone a knife.

I just think spyderco has the collectors covered, the man jewelry fans covered, the thinned out dedicated slicers covered, the steel junkies covered... Basically everything but hard use. All we have is a bunch of people claiming that they beat the living F out of their spyderco knives and see no damage, while cringing at anyone at admits to hard use (while often implying that they don't have issues because they "know how to use knives properly"), lol. The truth is, Spyderco's are not designed for hard use. For what they are, they are built extremely tough. I admit that. But where the focus is more on cutting performance (I completely understand why), there are often corners cut in regard to durability, IMO.

Anyone, feel free to cuss me out for going against the norm. I just call it like I see it. I do not abuse knives. But in a perfect world I'd like to baby them as little as possible.

[Donut]

All knives will break if you pry with them. Don't pry with your knives.

If abuse means something other than prying, then they will probably all stand more abuse than you can throw at them.

[Catamount123]

Of course, if you know ahead of time the task you will be doing, you choose/carry the tool best suited for it. I'm thinking about scenarios where you unexpectedly need to do something on the edge of what folders are suited for, and you only have a Spyder folder available. Which one would you want it to be?

[Pelagic]

All knives will break if you pry with them. Don't pry with your knives.

If abuse means something other than prying, then they will probably all stand more abuse than you can throw at them.

I absolutely agree with the first part.

With the second, our opinions differ (notice to all, I am NOT asserting that I am right here, this is only an opinion). There are many knives I've owned that I have never damaged inadvertently. I got into spyderco, and now I sometimes have to be extra careful so that I don't break the tip off or stress the pivot too much and cause blade play. It's JUST something I'VE noticed.

I know everyone will assume either I don't know how to use knives, or that I have bad habits or am flat out abusive in my use. If only you could walk a day in my shoes! You'd see that is certainly not true.

[The Meat man]

The terms "hard use" and "abuse" are a bit vague and subjective.

On one hand, I think we all intuitively know what the OP means by these terms, but on the other hand, when you start trying to come up with hard definitions, things get confusing.

Case in point: Pelagic (above) says that Spyderco knives are not designed for hard use. I was surprised to read this because in my mind Spyderco knives excel at hard use. That's what they're designed for right?

My point is not that I'm right and Pelagic is wrong (or vice versa), or that he doesn't know how to handle his knives, but that our understanding of the term "hard use" is clearly not the same. For him, hard use means something different from what I think. Thus it'll be hard to have an intelligent discussion about it until we come to some kind of understanding of what we each respectively mean by these terms.

And don't forget that the environment in which you are using your knife can have a huge impact on what constitutes "hard use", irrespective of the actual use of the knife.

I don't want to get too pedantic here. Just offering my two cents.

[ZrowsN1s]

Techno 1 looks pretty stout.

[The Meat man]

Of the dozen or so Spyderco knives I've owned and used, the one I'd grab if I had a really nasty job ahead of me would be the Pacific Salt.

Going by paper, the Tuff certainly looks, well, tough. Also the Shaman and the Techno knives.

[Evil D]

I feel like a lot of people really need to hold a Vallotton lol. I'd put one of those to hard use before a Manix or several other models mentioned. The thing is borderline ridiculous.

[Pelagic]

I feel like a lot of people really need to hold a Vallotton lol. I'd put one of those to hard use before a Manix or several other models mentioned. The thing is borderline ridiculous.

I'd be very interested in that. (holding and observing one to cure my ignorance)

[Pelagic]

Honestly this thread should be dedicated to models other than the Tuff. Much more interesting.

[Evil D]

I feel like a lot of people really need to hold a Vallotton lol. I'd put one of those to hard use before a Manix or several other models mentioned. The thing is borderline ridiculous.

I'd be very interested in that. (holding and observing one to cure my ignorance)

I sold my original to a retired officer who fell in love with it but every time I think about it I want another one. It's one of those knives that kinda sucks at being a knife if I'm honest, it slices pretty poorly due to how thick the blade is and how low the grind is, but the fit and finish is amazing and I liked the thickness of it. It has one of the thickest liner locks I've seen that wasn't a frame lock. I'd love to get another one and have it modified into an automatic.

[Surfingringo]

I think it kind of depends on what you consider tough and what you mean by abuse. I would agree that some of the knives mentioned like the Shaman and Tuff would fall into the category of "overbuilt" and should be considered capable of some hard use but neither of those would hold up very well to my typical abuse. I carry the humble Pacific Salt everyday and I beat it like a rented mule. It lives in a wet compartment covered in saltwater and fish goo. On a daily basis, it saws through fish bones, stabs through fish skulls, pries open toothy mouths to extract lures and routinely gets twisted, torqued and pushed beyond any normal limits. I have never broken one or damaged one to the point of making it dysfunctional. I have never made one rust, regardless of the level of exposure. I have never broken a tip. (I bent a tip once and simply bent them right back into shape). For me, the Pacific Salt is the ULTIMATE Spyderco "tough as nails" and "abuse proof" knife. What's more, unlike many other "overbuilt" folders, it is offered at a price that makes one feel ok about pushing it to its limits.

[Pelagic]

I'm speaking from ignorance, but it sure SEEMS like the Shaman and the Tuff are in 2 different leagues, regarding capability of withstanding abuse/mistakes.

[Evil D]

I think it kind of depends on what you consider tough and what you mean by abuse. I would agree that some of the knives mentioned like the Shaman and Tuff would fall into the category of "overbuilt" and should be considered capable of some hard use but neither of those would hold up very well to my typical abuse. I carry the humble Pacific Salt everyday and I beat it like a rented mule. It lives in a wet compartment covered in saltwater and fish goo. On a daily basis, it saws through fish bones, stabs through fish skulls, pries open toothy mouths to extract lures and routinely gets twisted, torqued and pushed beyond any normal limits. I have never broken one or damaged one to the point of making it dysfunctional. I have never made one rust, regardless of the level of exposure. I have never broken a tip. (I bent a tip once and simply bent them right back into shape). For me, the Pacific Salt is the ULTIMATE Spyderco "tough as nails" and "abuse proof" knife. What's more, unlike many other "overbuilt" folders, it is offered at a price that makes one feel ok about pushing it to its limits.

That's a lot of fair points. The dollar-to-damage ratio is a pretty big one. I think most of us can agree about what is reasonable use vs unnecessary abuse, but this topic is fun just to sort out what is capable of handling it the best. The Vallotton or TUFF may take more outright abuse than a Pacific but you'll also pay 2-3 times more for them so most of us sane people will be much more hesitant to lean on them when necessary. I can tell you in all honesty I feel a bit foolish for using my Autonomy the way I do when I could be using a Pacific for half the price, but I do enjoy it.

[Catamount123]

Good points about the Pacific Salt, I usually carry an old one loose in my pocket. I use it for things I don't want to subject my other Spyders to, or if someone asks to borrow a knife.

[Brock O Lee]

I'm speaking from ignorance, but it sure SEEMS like the Shaman and the Tuff are in 2 different leagues, regarding capability of withstanding abuse/mistakes.

The Shaman is beefy, but the Tuff is in another league. Compare steel toughness, tips, blade stock and grind, stop pin and pivot diameters, liner thickness, lock stiffness. I can carry on...

Tuff left, Shaman right:



The Manix feels like an office EDC in comparison.



Good point about Pacific Salt... All these “tough” folders will wimper and die within weeks (days?) in a wet and salty boat compartment.

[vivi]

I don't think anyone wants to bend a folder at the pivot laterally like that. I wouldn't even do that to a Cold Steel SR1 if the blade was made of s7.... at the end of the day, a folder is a folder. And what is shown in that video would even be abuse of a hammer or prybar, let alone a knife.

I just think spyderco has the collectors covered, the man jewelry fans covered, the thinned out dedicated slicers covered, the steel junkies covered... Basically everything but hard use. All we have is a bunch of people claiming that they beat the living F out of their spyderco knives and see no damage, while cringing at anyone at admits to hard use (while often implying that they don't have issues because they "know how to use knives properly"), lol. The truth is, Spyderco's are not designed for hard use. For what they are, they are built extremely tough. I admit that. But where the focus is more on cutting performance (I completely understand why), there are often corners cut in regard to durability, IMO.

Anyone, feel free to cuss me out for going against the norm. I just call it like I see it. I do not abuse knives. But in a perfect world I'd like to baby them as little as possible.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=hl3n-BtLoaI&t=0m50s

I think Spyderco makes some pretty tough folders. I've put Pacific Salts and Manix's through the ringer.

Don't really get the draw of an ultratough folder though. Why not carry a small fixed blade?

[Crux]

The International Council of Folding Knives has already stated that the Para 3 is the toughest folder in the world, but withdraw their vote after being firebombed by unreasonable PM2 and Millie fans. Get over it fellows.

[Bill1170]

In the real world of practical folder use, toughness has to be balanced with cutting performance. The toughest folder will be a less good slicer, and conversely the best slicer is poor at withstanding lateral forces.

Engineering is about compromises and optimization. Each user has to find their own sweet spot for their knife needs. The words “tough” and “toughness” get thrown around a lot, usually without being defined. From what I’ve seen, these words as applied to folding knives at one time or another have meant any of the following:

-edge impact resistance (such as when chopping)
-tip strength for piercing or prying strong materials without bending or breaking
-blade, pivot, and handle strength to resist bending or failure under prying loads
-lock strength, reliability, or resistance to spine whacking
-edge stability at a given included angle and thickness behind the edge
-impact resistance of handle, pivot, and/or lock (as encountered in being dropped, throwing, or batoning)
-heat and chemical resistance, which includes corrosion of metal parts

The Manix line seems like a nice tough folder line that still retains useful levels of cutting performance. The Pacific Salt, as mentioned by Lance, is another very tough knife that retains practical utility. The Tuff is extremely tough, but probably was discontinued because it was overkill for most users, plus heavy and expensive. Saber ground Delicas and Enduras are also what I consider tough knives.

[Ankerson]

The Native 5 G10 with the liners is the toughest thing they make currently.

It's built like a tank.

I doubt you could hurt it except if you really tried to under extreme circumstances.