Spyderco Forums

Couldn't help but notice this Spyderco Subvert showing a MSRP of $470, with BladeHQ price of over $300. For a Taiwan made G10 scaled S30V liner lock?

Am I missing something here? Seems... Pricey.

https://www.bladehq.com/item--Spyderco- ... ock--82802

I think the collaborations sometimes have prices all over the map, because the collaborators don't want to spike their own custom sales.

I tend to think of them as "mid-tech" knives--somewhere between the custom and mass production.

I'm kind of with you on the Subvert though--not my cup of tea at all. But I'm sure there are some people who will love it.

Big knife with lots of titanium. Materials add up.

Collaborations are often priced high as mentioned. I’m not sure why so many people question the pricing (and often quality) of Taichung Spydies? They are typically the best made Spyderco’s, worthy of their price points.

spyderg wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 2:31 pm

Collaborations are often priced high as mentioned. I’m not sure why so many people question the pricing (and often quality) of Taichung Spydies? They are typically the best made Spyderco’s, worthy of their price points.

I completely agree with this. While all Spydies are amazingly well made knives, the fit and finish of the models that come out of Taichung is second to none. And they are priced accordingly, which only seems fair.

TomAiello wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 2:00 pm

I think the collaborations sometimes have prices all over the map, because the collaborators don't want to spike their own custom sales.

I tend to think of them as "mid-tech" knives--somewhere between the custom and mass production.

That's a wise move.



OP
I think your focusing too much on the Taiwan made side and not the other details.

I think there are two basic reasons why collaboration models are generally more expensive. First, is that there's one more mouth to feed. Second, and perhaps more importantly, tooling costs have to be recouped and, in that regard, collaboration models have always been a greater risk for Spyderco than in house designs. Very few collaboration models have remained in Spyderco's lineup for more than three years and a significant number have lasted only one.

Also, as far as materials go, I didn't hear many people complaining about the cost of a slysz Bowie and not too many complain about the cost of a CRK. Both titanium and both in steels comparable to s30v. I can think of other examples. I think the price is valid. I don't think it is a bargain or extreme value, but it is a fair price.

The Deacon wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 2:49 pm

Very few collaboration models have remained in Spyderco's lineup for more than three years and a significant number have lasted only one.

Out of curiosity, what are the longest lasting collaborations?

Based on the listed weight, the description, and pics elsewhere, the Subvert looks like a frame lock with scales over it. Then the blade is tall on top of the length. As others have said, it's a lot of materials. It's a big, heavy knife.For me it's also easier to question the price when I don't find a design to be appealing.

I’ve got a few titanium framelock flippers that are collaborations, manufactured by WE knives, so made in China not Taiwan.
But, they were under 150 USD and the quality is outstanding. Faultless.
In the end though, it is what it is. Prices don’t necessarily reflect manufacturing costs. It’s best to look at knives like this as art, then the price starts to make sense.
The higher price also creates an exclusivity that raises the perceived value of a model.

If you think the Subvert is pricey (it is) take a look at the Paysan.

https://www.knifecenter.com/item/SP238T ... ium-handle

p_atrick wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:07 pm

The Deacon wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 2:49 pm

Very few collaboration models have remained in Spyderco's lineup for more than three years and a significant number have lasted only one.

Out of curiosity, what are the longest lasting collaborations?

Maybe the centofante at this point

GarageBoy wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 4:29 pm

p_atrick wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:07 pm

The Deacon wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 2:49 pm

Very few collaboration models have remained in Spyderco's lineup for more than three years and a significant number have lasted only one.

Out of curiosity, what are the longest lasting collaborations?

Maybe the centofante at this point

Centofante would definitely be one, as would both Moran fixed blades. Fred Perrin's Street Beat has had a good run and his Street Bowie, while not a constant, has been in and out of the lineup several times. Am sure there are others that have either been around a good while or keep coming back, but my point was that collaborations have rarely, if ever, been high volume models.

p_atrick wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:07 pm

The Deacon wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 2:49 pm

Very few collaboration models have remained in Spyderco's lineup for more than three years and a significant number have lasted only one.

Out of curiosity, what are the longest lasting collaborations?

Probably the Moran fixed blades. They've been around for decades.

Tims wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:43 pm

I’ve got a few titanium framelock flippers that are collaborations, manufactured by WE knives, so made in China not Taiwan.
But, they were under 150 USD and the quality is outstanding. Faultless.
In the end though, it is what it is. Prices don’t necessarily reflect manufacturing costs. It’s best to look at knives like this as art, then the price starts to make sense.
The higher price also creates an exclusivity that raises the perceived value of a model.

I believe Sal has said the exchange rate and other factors enable them to produce a knife in China for 1/6th the cost of making it in the US. For example, if the Cara Cara 2 in G10 costs Spyderco $20 to make and they sell for $30, a US made Cara Cara might cost $120 to make and sell for $180.

Would you have purchased that WE knife if it were made in the US and sold for $500-600?

Vivi wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:26 pm

Tims wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:43 pm

I’ve got a few titanium framelock flippers that are collaborations, manufactured by WE knives, so made in China not Taiwan.
But, they were under 150 USD and the quality is outstanding. Faultless.
In the end though, it is what it is. Prices don’t necessarily reflect manufacturing costs. It’s best to look at knives like this as art, then the price starts to make sense.
The higher price also creates an exclusivity that raises the perceived value of a model.

I believe Sal has said the exchange rate and other factors enable them to produce a knife in China for 1/6th the cost of making it in the US. For example, if the Cara Cara 2 in G10 costs Spyderco $20 to make and they sell for $30, a US made Cara Cara might cost $120 to make and sell for $180.

Would you have purchased that WE knife if it were made in the US and sold for $500-600?

Most wouldn't.


Which brings up the other point about prices, living standards etc.
People want Chinese prices but US living standards.
Would people be prepared to have the living standards of China if everything they purchased was cheaper ?
I doubt it.

Vivi wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:26 pm

Tims wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:43 pm

I’ve got a few titanium framelock flippers that are collaborations, manufactured by WE knives, so made in China not Taiwan.
But, they were under 150 USD and the quality is outstanding. Faultless.
In the end though, it is what it is. Prices don’t necessarily reflect manufacturing costs. It’s best to look at knives like this as art, then the price starts to make sense.
The higher price also creates an exclusivity that raises the perceived value of a model.

I believe Sal has said the exchange rate and other factors enable them to produce a knife in China for 1/6th the cost of making it in the US. For example, if the Cara Cara 2 in G10 costs Spyderco $20 to make and they sell for $30, a US made Cara Cara might cost $120 to make and sell for $180.

Would you have purchased that WE knife if it were made in the US and sold for $500-600?

I wouldn’t spend 500-600 on a knife period. But the WE knife would fetch that much if it was consistent with what the rest of the market was doing. If every manufacturer was charging similar $$ for similar quality.

If that knife was marketed to be ‘exclusive’, ie low production number, higher price, made in the US, you can bet people would pay the big bucks and wouldn’t be disappointed with the quality.

I don’t take it too seriously. Nobody owes me anything, especially not a knife at a certain price point. If I want it and can afford it, I buy it. If I deem the price too high, I move on.

I think it’s a cool looking blade. I dig many of the collaboration model spydies. I’m looking forward to getting it on closeout when it’s discontinued.

There's tons of Chinese knives that are now over $500 including WE https://www.bladehq.com/item--WE-Knife- ... ife--80883