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Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:18 pm
by SpyderEdgeForever
I told someone I was chatting with that I like to collect knives and there is a whole world of people into collecting knives and other things, such as watches, stamps, you name it. Their response to me is that "Collecting anything beyond one or two items that you will use is greed, selfish, and uncaring, in a world where people are starving to death and cannot even get adequate water and electricity. Other than one or perhaps two personal knives you intend to use, that is greed."
What is a good response to this person?
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:57 pm
by knivesandbooks
I can come up with scenarios in which a collector can be greedy regarding their collecting habits but collecting on a whole is obviously not. There are obviously normative considerations to the act of collecting but I don't think collecting or possessing a collection has any moral value.
Sidenote, the biggest ethical issue in the hobby, in my opinion, are flippers.
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 10:31 pm
by vivi
I think it's selfish buying knives you have no need for.
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 10:54 pm
by MichaelScott
I’d ask just how much stuff he has that could be sold to help starving people in Chicago. I’d say that because I earn enough money to buy “non-essentials” like beer, wine, bakery bread, steaks, knives it’s none of his business how I spend it. I’m not obligated to poverty myself in response to other people’s needs.
I’d say he is a sanctimonious busy-body that should stick with his socialist pals and leave free people alone.
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:45 pm
by shunsui
I think most collectors are closet investors. While flippers are low drag, high speed sellers; collector/investors keep their knives much longer, but they eventually sell or pass on their investment to their heirs.
Others may spin their collection so they can keep sampling new and different knives on a fixed size investment.
I suppose some theories of political economics would look down on anything that wasn't contributing to some utopian 5 year plan, but having a middle class actually powers what passes for civilization.
The poor are invariably kept around to motivate the middle class. :eek:
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:06 am
by The Mastiff
What is a good response to this person?
The only good commie is a dead commie. :)
Yeah I've felt selfish and greedy a few times. If I have more than I need and if something is in demand I sometimes give it away. Saying that however doesn't mean I will tolerate someone like that with a small mind and large opinion attempting to annoy me.
That is also one of the reasons I don't solicit opinions from idiots or anybody else for that matter. My morals are for me and my own conscience . When I ask for advice it's typically something more practical like " what is best to kill aphids on tomatos but won't kill everything else?". If my actions need to be questioned I'm capable of doing that internally.
SEF, I think you reach out to the wrong people sometimes? Did you not see that coming? Someone like that is usually easy to see and even forecast a reaction from and I question the reasoning of your discussion with them on that subject. Were you bored? :)
Joe
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 3:14 am
by The Deacon
SpyderEdgeForever wrote: ↑Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:18 pm
I told someone I was chatting with that I like to collect knives and there is a whole world of people into collecting knives and other things, such as watches, stamps, you name it. Their response to me is that "Collecting anything beyond one or two items that you will use is greed, selfish, and uncaring, in a world where people are starving to death and cannot even get adequate water and electricity. Other than one or perhaps two personal knives you intend to use, that is greed."
What is a good response to this person?
Roll your eyes, shake your head, and walk away?
Laugh in their face?
Tell them that overpopulation is the main cause of global warming, so letting some starve is good for the planet?
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 4:49 am
by Larry_Mott
Why i collect knives?
For those who understand, no explanation is necessary
For those who don't understand, no explanation is possible.
(feel free to replace 'knives' with stamps, sports cars, baseball cards or whatever you want.)
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:55 am
by SpyderEdgeForever
MichaelScott wrote: ↑Fri Sep 07, 2018 10:54 pm
I’d ask just how much stuff he has that could be sold to help starving people in Chicago. I’d say that because I earn enough money to buy “non-essentials” like beer, wine, bakery bread, steaks, knives it’s none of his business how I spend it. I’m not obligated to poverty myself in response to other people’s needs.
I’d say he is a sanctimonious busy-body that should stick with his socialist pals and leave free people alone.
Thank you very much for this, Michael! This person did seem to have that exact attitude as you describe, infact. His claim is that because he has chosen to have what he calls a "simple outlook" on life, then everyone else must adhere to that, as well, and anyone who masses any sort of collection of things, whether knives or stamps, is "greedy" because there are people who are suffering lack.
I also thought of this as a secondary response, what say you to it:? "Why should one person have to suffer poverty so another doesn't, when the greater answer is to "increase the size of the pie so that everyone can benefit in the long term?" Then people can have both the things they need such as clean water, shelter, food, medicine, etc, and, they can also have things they enjoy such as collecting and hobbies.
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:58 am
by SpyderEdgeForever
The Mastiff wrote: ↑Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:06 am
What is a good response to this person?
The only good commie is a dead commie. :)
Yeah I've felt selfish and greedy a few times. If I have more than I need and if something is in demand I sometimes give it away. Saying that however doesn't mean I will tolerate someone like that with a small mind and large opinion attempting to annoy me.
That is also one of the reasons I don't solicit opinions from idiots or anybody else for that matter. My morals are for me and my own conscience . When I ask for advice it's typically something more practical like " what is best to kill aphids on tomatos but won't kill everything else?". If my actions need to be questioned I'm capable of doing that internally.
SEF, I think you reach out to the wrong people sometimes? Did you not see that coming? Someone like that is usually easy to see and even forecast a reaction from and I question the reasoning of your discussion with them on that subject. Were you bored? :)
Joe
Well, I was curious as to what he thought of knives and knife collecting. The same person (And I am not putting down those who choose to eat vegan/vegetarian foods by this) is a self-professed "vegan and enviromentalist" and claims those of us (myself included) who eat meat and animal products on a regular basis, are "destroying mother earth" because, according to him, it takes more energy and resources to produce meat than it does to produce vegetables and grains, and so anyone who has chosen not to eat a meat/dairy-free diet, is responsible in some way for destroying the earth and enviroment. And regarding knife types, the person has the attitude that noone needs "combat style knives" because those are "weapons for warmongers."
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:00 am
by SpyderEdgeForever
Vivi wrote: ↑Fri Sep 07, 2018 10:31 pm
I think it's selfish buying knives you have no need for.
How would one determine if a particular knife is needed vs merely desired as a collector piece? If you use it on a regular basis to perform cutting chores?
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:01 am
by SpyderEdgeForever
knivesandbooks wrote: ↑Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:57 pm
I can come up with scenarios in which a collector can be greedy regarding their collecting habits but collecting on a whole is obviously not. There are obviously normative considerations to the act of collecting but I don't think collecting or possessing a collection has any moral value.
Sidenote, the biggest ethical issue in the hobby, in my opinion, are flippers.
Is that because most flippers are not practical utility tools but more like novel mechanism knives?
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:10 am
by Evil D
I'd ask them to show you the monastery they live in and how they've dedicated their life to sacrifice. Ask them how many pairs of shoes they own, how many TV's are in their house, how many cars they own, how often they eat out or get Starbucks, etc. That's a BS answer by someone who just doesn't understand our hobby but probably does more wasteful things with their money.
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:16 am
by The Meat man
There are many things in life that we own and use but do not need. This doesn't make them wrong or immoral, nor does it place a burden of guilt upon those who enjoy them.
For example, humans did without electricity and indoor plumbing for thousands of years. We do not "need" these conveniences, but there is nothing wrong with them. SEF, perhaps your friend should consider whether or not he is willing to forgo those two "unneeded" conveniences in the interests of the poor.
Collecting knives, like any hobby, can be carried to the extreme, where it might become a problem. If it becomes your sole interest in life, and causes you to neglect more important things, it is a problem.
Edit:
Evil D, you beat me to the post. Excellent points.
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:11 am
by demoncase
SpyderEdgeForever wrote: ↑Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:18 pm
I told someone I was chatting with that I like to collect knives and there is a whole world of people into collecting knives and other things, such as watches, stamps, you name it. Their response to me is that "Collecting anything beyond one or two items that you will use is greed, selfish, and uncaring, in a world where people are starving to death and cannot even get adequate water and electricity. Other than one or perhaps two personal knives you intend to use, that is greed."
What is a good response to this person?
I would quote a Buddhist aphorism:
The Monkey Puzzle tree takes 30 years before it flowers or bears edible fruit.
A young monk walked into the monastery gardens one day and found a 100 year old monk planting monkey puzzle saplings.
The young monk asked "Ancient master, but why do you plant the monkey puzzle for you will never see it flower nor ever taste it's fruit?"
The ancient master stood up and leaned on his shovel and nodded at the garden before he replied serenely:
"My son- this is my ****ing garden and I plant whatever the **** I want"
Or- "It's my money and I'll spend it on whatever I please"....Savvy? :D
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 10:03 am
by Crux
SpyderEdgeForever wrote: ↑Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:18 pm
I told someone I was chatting with that I like to collect knives and there is a whole world of people into collecting knives and other things, such as watches, stamps, you name it. Their response to me is that "Collecting anything beyond one or two items that you will use is greed, selfish, and uncaring, in a world where people are starving to death and cannot even get adequate water and electricity. Other than one or perhaps two personal knives you intend to use, that is greed."
What is a good response to this person?
Call me, Mister Greed.
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 10:09 am
by MichaelScott
SpyderEdgeForever wrote: ↑Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:55 am
MichaelScott wrote: ↑Fri Sep 07, 2018 10:54 pm
I’d ask just how much stuff he has that could be sold to help starving people in Chicago. I’d say that because I earn enough money to buy “non-essentials” like beer, wine, bakery bread, steaks, knives it’s none of his business how I spend it. I’m not obligated to poverty myself in response to other people’s needs.
I’d say he is a sanctimonious busy-body that should stick with his socialist pals and leave free people alone.
Thank you very much for this, Michael! This person did seem to have that exact attitude as you describe, infact. His claim is that because he has chosen to have what he calls a "simple outlook" on life, then everyone else must adhere to that, as well, and anyone who masses any sort of collection of things, whether knives or stamps, is "greedy" because there are people who are suffering lack.
I also thought of this as a secondary response, what say you to it:? "Why should one person have to suffer poverty so another doesn't, when the greater answer is to "increase the size of the pie so that everyone can benefit in the long term?" Then people can have both the things they need such as clean water, shelter, food, medicine, etc, and, they can also have things they enjoy such as collecting and hobbies.
Your friend evidently does not know that the global level of poverty is constantly falling, that more people have access to such things as fresh water, electricity, medicine, etc. This is driven by capitalism which means that stealing goods and money from some people and giving that to those who don’t have it doesn’t work. Have your friend read what happened under his system in the twentieth century. About 100 million people died and were killed because of is socialist ideas.
As to his anti-meat ideas, all life lives on the death and consumption of other life. If this wasn’t an effective system, evolution would not have worked that way for billions of years. He is either ignorant of basic science, or isn’t but prefers his ideology to facts.
You might consider hanging around with smarter people.
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 11:11 am
by kbuzbee
SpyderEdgeForever wrote: ↑Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:01 am
knivesandbooks wrote: ↑Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:57 pm
Sidenote, the biggest ethical issue in the hobby, in my opinion, are flippers.
Is that because most flippers are not practical utility tools but more like novel mechanism knives?
You’re probably joking but I’m assuming he meant “knife flippers” not “flipper style knives”
Ken
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 11:25 am
by michaelm466
I'm just helping to support all the employees of Spyderco, the global companies they do business with, their distributors, retailers, etc.
Re: Is collecting knives and other items greedy? How would you answer this person?
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 11:43 am
by bearfacedkiller
It doesn’t matter how much of a minimalist he is. What is really more important, how much you have or how much you give? How much has he given to others? I would ask him that.
I am not a very material person and knives are one of the few exceptions to that for me. In the rest of my life I am very pragmatic and a bit of a minimalist ( my wife calls me a tight wad :) ). I think it is important to a person's mental health to have interests in life outside of work and family. For me it is the outdoors, self sufficiency and cutlery. Having a hobby is not greed.
I am not a wealthy man, I am a blue collar guy who gives when he can and contributes to his community. That is all I can do. I don’t preach and I don’t judge. Ghandi said, “Be the change you want see in the world”. That is all I can do. Your friend seems to likely posses two qualities I dislike. He sounds self righteous and judgmental.