The Waterway Will Be Mine...

[Xplorer]

Congratulations Lance! The Water Way is great looking design. I can't wait to get one! The picture on 116-117 is really cool. I think the fact that it's being made in Golden is amazing! Well Done!

[Surfingringo]

A big congrats to you Lance! :)

The knife looks great with a practical design that should work in any field application on or off the water. :cool:

Unless I missed it what I’d like to ask is what is the blade stock thickness? In the link to the electronic cattle dog it says it’s 3.4mm which seems way thick for a knife like this. :confused:

Hey Bloke, the thickness is indeed 3.4 mm. The Waterway was not so much designed as a purely fish processing knife, but rather a jack of all trades utility knife that is optimized to be capable of fish work such as bait chopping, gill cutting, and removing fillets. I've got plenty of dedicated fillet knives...this was meant to be a different animal altogether. The thicker stock is there to make the knife more robust and capable of tasks that one wouldn't perform with a fillet knife like braining fish and heavier utility chores. The goal was to create a knife that would readily accomplish my main fishing chores but also serve as my everyday "rough and tumble" fixed blade and hopefully appeal to as many different folks as possible. I wanted to create something that everyone could enjoy. :)

[ThePeacent]

the design is truly well thought out, Lance.
It's the basic do it all shape, nothing too specialised. Seems like it'd work good enough for bushcraft, kitchen use, gardening chores, fixed EDC or hunting.
The steel adds to that, in the corrosion resistance and maintenance department especially.

I'd envision a series of "mule" knives with this design to try out all kind of steels and new materials, as I believe it much more do-it-all and properly sized than the current Mule design.
:spyder:

Even more the handle material beats most others for general acceptance and uses, obviously surpassing the scale-less Mules in this regard, without adding the cost of most custom scales that would be very expensive

Truly excellent creation, and hopefully successful in the future! :)
Feel proud of this brainchild of yours

[Bloke]

Hey Bloke, the thickness is indeed 3.4 mm.

Thanks Lance. :)

I’m adverse to thick blades and um’d and ah’d before I bought my Sprig thinking the blade was thicker than I’d like and it’s turned out a special.:cool:

Anyhow, I like what I see, don’t have any LC200N and how could I pass on your first design? :rolleyes:

[Surfingringo]

Hey Bloke, the thickness is indeed 3.4 mm.

Thanks Lance. :)

I’m adverse to thick blades and um’d and ah’d before I bought my Sprig thinking the blade was thicker than I’d like and it’s turned out a special.:cool:

Anyhow, I like what I see, don’t have any LC200N and how could I pass on your first design? :rolleyes:

Performance will depend as much on the grind as it does on blade stock. I have a custom of the same thickness that was the first prototype. The blade is ground thin to about 10 thousandths behind the edge. it cuts like a dream and you don't even notice the extra thickness at the spine (at least I don't when doing fish work). I would like the knife to be ground fairly thin but there are definitely limits on what Spyderco can do with a production piece like this. If they grind it too thin then somebody will be making a youtube video complaining about how the edge rolled while batoning through a tenpenny nail. :rolleyes:

[attila]

...the thickness is indeed 3.4 mm.

Performance will depend as much on the grind as it does on blade stock. I have a custom of the same thickness that was the first prototype. The blade is ground thin to about 10 thousandths behind the edge. it cuts like a dream and you don't even notice the extra thickness at the spine (at least I don't when doing fish work). I would like the knife to be ground fairly thin but there are definitely limits on what Spyderco can do with a production piece like this. If they grind it too thin then somebody will be making a youtube video complaining about how the edge rolled while batoning through a tenpenny nail. :rolleyes:

Hey Lance,

I was curious if you know what the hardness the Waterway's LC200N is going to be? I checked the Zapp datasheet, which only compares it to 440B and 420 at 56 HRC, but the verbiage and heat treat charts show it as being easily capable of 58-60 HRC. High-hardness wear resistance, toughness, and corrosion resistance comparisons were not provided, leaving me wondering what LC200N compares to with different heat treatments.

I plan on getting one regardless, but I am curious to know this datapoint. If Spyderco's LC200N heat treat puts it in the higher end of the hardness band, that would potentially explain why in "cut tests" and reviews people are claiming that this low carbon nitrogen steel is in the same wear resistance league as CTS-XHP and CPM M4. Even the GP Knives product page makes the above claim. Such performance would be astounding for a rustproof blade!

I want to but have a hard time believing such claims when looking at the chemistry/datasheet, so I was hoping for your input on its expected hardness and performance.

Thank you!

[Surfingringo]

...the thickness is indeed 3.4 mm.

Performance will depend as much on the grind as it does on blade stock. I have a custom of the same thickness that was the first prototype. The blade is ground thin to about 10 thousandths behind the edge. it cuts like a dream and you don't even notice the extra thickness at the spine (at least I don't when doing fish work). I would like the knife to be ground fairly thin but there are definitely limits on what Spyderco can do with a production piece like this. If they grind it too thin then somebody will be making a youtube video complaining about how the edge rolled while batoning through a tenpenny nail. :rolleyes:

Hey Lance,

I was curious if you know what the hardness the Waterway's LC200N is going to be? I checked the Zapp datasheet, which only compares it to 440B and 420 at 56 HRC, but the verbiage and heat treat charts show it as being easily capable of 58-60 HRC. High-hardness wear resistance, toughness, and corrosion resistance comparisons were not provided, leaving me wondering what LC200N compares to with different heat treatments.

I plan on getting one regardless, but I am curious to know this datapoint. If Spyderco's LC200N heat treat puts it in the higher end of the hardness band, that would potentially explain why in "cut tests" and reviews people are claiming that this low carbon nitrogen steel is in the same wear resistance league as CTS-XHP and CPM M4. Even the GP Knives product page makes the above claim. Such performance would be astounding for a rustproof blade!

I want to but have a hard time believing such claims when looking at the chemistry/datasheet, so I was hoping for your input on its expected hardness and performance.

Thank you!

Hi Attila, per my last conversation with Sal, I believe they are getting about 59 out of it. I have a folder prototype that Chad Kelly (Xplorer42) made for me last summer and his HT on lc200n tested at 60 I believe. I hear folks tossing around numbers like 61-62 but I don't think anyone is actually getting in there. In any case, the steel performs very well at 59.

As far as comparing it to some of the more wear resistant steels, I think vg10 is a pretty fair comparison. I just finished testing lc200n against cpm154 and Vanax SC and it held dead even for the first couple hundred feet of cardboard but I felt that the cpm154 and Vanax had a slight advantage in holding a dullish working edge before completely rounding off. When you factor its solid edge performance, its rust proof properties and its excellent sharpening response, I would consider lc200n as much of a "super steel" as many other steels carrying that moniker.

[attila]

That's as great an answer as I could have hoped for! Thanks again.

[jalcon]

Wow, congratulations Lance. That's pretty badass. I enjoy your posts alot, and can tell you have a great passion about this stuff. Made in USA ftw! Very cool!

[Doc Dan]

VG-10 performance is pretty good. I'll take it.

[vivi]

Saw this today. No idea if it's the final version but I like how this looks. Grippy G10 texture and a narrow sheath. Even more excited for it.

[Calicoast]

Yes, this is a must buy for me. Love the lines, full tang, scales, lc200n, more baja time. Money on standby.

[Surfingringo]

Saw this today. No idea if it's the final version but I like how this looks. Grippy G10 texture and a narrow sheath. Even more excited for it.

Hey vivi, yep, that is it. Glad you noticed (and like) the sheath. The folded sheath was more expensive to produce but was important to me as I wanted this to be a slim carry that can be stuck inside a waistband comfortably. I carried mine everyday for a full month IWB at 1:00. After a couple of days I didn’t even notice it was there.

[Bloke]

Certainly a must have! :cool:

[JimP]

Saw this today. No idea if it's the final version but I like how this looks. Grippy G10 texture and a narrow sheath. Even more excited for it.

This package looks awesome, the sheath looks great with the thumb push area which was sadly missing from the Southfork.

Lance, is this an accurate pic of the knife handle regarding no exposed pins or screws? It looks like a FRN moulded handle in the pic but I assume it is still G10?

[buccilli15]

Lance, I'm really considering purchasing one for an outdoors knife..specifically for camping and backpacking/hiking. Thoughts? Or it designed more for fishing (filleting?)
Thx!

[Surfingringo]

Hey Buccilli, part of the design process was to create a “do it all” knife that was optimized to be capable of fish processing. The Waterway is plenty tough enough for camping and bushcraft type duties and these were some of the very chores i had in mind when designing the knife. I am planning to write a short piece about the philosophy of the design and I will post it up here once it’s complete.

[buccilli15]

Hey Buccilli, part of the design process was to create a “do it all” knife that was optimized to be capable of fish processing. The Waterway is plenty tough enough for camping and bushcraft type duties and these were some of the very chores i had in mind when designing the knife. I am planning to write a short piece about the philosophy of the design and I will post it up here once it’s complete.

Awesome, thanks for the reply! I'm looking forward to their release! :D

[Bloke]

I caught a little itsy bitsy glimpse of the Waterway today but bloody Lance got in the way. :rolleyes:

Check this out! :cool:

https://youtu.be/ID7RJmMkNLE

[Mushroom]

I caught a little itsy bitsy glimpse of the Waterway today but bloody Lance got in the way. :rolleyes:

Check this out! :cool:

https://youtu.be/ID7RJmMkNLE

That was a badass video! Very well done!
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Congrats again, Lance!