Advantages to Auto Knives

[SlideTechnik]

What are the advantages to an auto knife over a standard folding knife? I don't get to play with these so I don't get to figure out why people are attracted to them.

I understand that the deployment of the blade would certainly be faster, but the difference seems like it might be negligable, and at the expense of more parts to fail in a knife as well as possible accidental deployment.

Are they all for style points or is there something more to them?


Thanks

[FreeRider67]

it's mainly for fast deployment. especially if you're in a one handed situation. I have a few autos, and a couple of out-the-front

[SlideTechnik]

Interesting. Is the faster opening worth the compromises?

[cosmo7809]

Honestly for me they are for a cool factor... They mostly do not leave the house and if they do, its for something like a quick run to the store.

As far as the advantages, I think fast deployment and for sure an intimidation factor (If you need to use in that type of situation :eek: )

[SlideTechnik]

Does spyderco make automatic knives? I haven't seen any on their site. I feel like I've heard talk of them though.

[cosmo7809]

http://spyderco.com/catalog/2009SpydercoSAS.pdf :D

[SlideTechnik]

Haha thanks. Google answered my question as well soon after I posted it lol.

[genius5th]

i believe autos are definitly cool factor gadgets and good for opening quickly if you have limited hand movement but comprimises are easy to get junk into and complcated mechanics may make it fail.

[The Deacon]

IMHO, for anyone without a medical condition which makes using one more difficult than pushing a button the Spyderhole opener has reduced automatics to the status of toys. Something to play with, or make one feel like a bit of a badass. No way to prove it, but I would not be surprised if, in the USA, more automatics are owned illegally than legally. There is a certain thrill to breaking a silly law. I'd also bet that a higher percentage of cops in states where they are the only ones who can legally carry an auto carry one than do cops in states where anyone can carry one.

That said, I would rank a classic stag handled Italian switchblade, such as those made by Frank Betrame, among both the ten best looking, and ten most iconic, knives in the world.

[jujigatame]

One advantage some folks may like is that, along with fast opening once pressed, a button lock with a safety is designed not to open until you complete two actions to set it in motion. Pulling on the blade with your fingers, flinging it hard in an arc with your wrist or arm, dropping it on the floor, etc., should not budge it. Liner locks, back locks, BB/Axis-style locks all possess a bias towards closing to varying degrees but there is greater potential it can be overcome by any of the above actions compared to a safetied auto, IMO.

[Cave Dave]

I assume they are harder to close, since you have to work against the spring. Is that correct or is it negligible?

[The Deacon]

I assume they are harder to close, since you have to work against the spring. Is that correct or is it negligible?

In my (admittedly extremely limited) experience, yes. Any that I've ever handled required considerably more effort to close than a conventional locking folder. Can't say I've ever handled one which could be easily closed one handed.

One advantage some folks may like is that, along with fast opening once pressed, a button lock with a safety is designed not to open until you complete two actions to set it in motion. Pulling on the blade with your fingers, flinging it hard in an arc with your wrist or arm, dropping it on the floor, etc., should not budge it. Liner locks, back locks, BB/Axis-style locks all possess a bias towards closing to varying degrees but there is greater potential it can be overcome by any of the above actions compared to a safetied auto, IMO.

I have to think it would be possible to build a conventional locking folder with a safety to prevent unintentional opening. The fact few, if any, exist makes me guess there is limited need and/or limited interest. That, in turn, makes me think problems from accidental opening are fairly rare and not very serious. Otherwise, we'd be seeing ads something like "Have you, or someone you love, been injured when an Acme Dingbat folder opened without warning? If so, contact the law firm of Dewey, Cheatham, and Howe immediately!" on TV.

Of the three examples you give, two are conscious actions, which can be avoided rather easily and, if the blade of a dropped knife were to open, that action would normally not endanger the owner.

Personally, I'd consider almost any Spyderco midlock, carried tip down, to be about as safe as an auto carried with the safety on, faster to deploy, and a heck of a lot less complex. I'm not sure, but tend to doubt, anyone could survive a landing which caused a Stretch carried that way to open far enough to cause injury. I know I've carried a locking folder, be it Buck, Schrade, or Spyderco, loose in my back pocket for at least forty years without ever having one open.

On the other hand, without a safety engaged, autos, especially those which are triggered by a button, are an accident waiting to happen. An act as simple as leaning against a railing can release the blade and, if that happens, the strong opening action increases the risk of self inflicted injury considerably. Carrying one the way I carry my Stretch would be idiotic. IMHO, if anyone has benefited even a little over the past fifty years from the restrictions on automatics, it's been the health insurance industry.

Edited to add: In spite of all that, part of me wants to believe that, since some fairly intelligent people carry them, there must be some rational benefit, and not just macho "Joe Cool" BS, involved.

[VashHash]

i just find autos complicate things i never was much for the law so i buy what i think looks good doesn't mean i carry it or have intentions to carry it but it doesn't make it right either but they'res just too many things that can go south on an auto i want something dependable everytime not having to worry if my spring is sprung or broken or my button is jammed give me the spyderhole abimdextrous and reliable autos usually have one button that can only be accessed from one side

[jzmtl]

IMHO, for anyone without a medical condition which makes using one more difficult than pushing a button the Spyderhole opener has reduced automatics to the status of toys.

I've had a few times that it's so cold, I lost most of the motor skills in my hand, one hand opening a blade with either hole or stud is out of the question, even open an assisted opener is doubtful. I'd imagine push a button would be possible in that situation, but since I can't have one I won't be able to find out.

[Tecun]

SlideTechnik, I think auto Spyderco knives are some of the best in the industry. I have used a bunch of different brands and Spyderco has really done a great job. Biggest benefit for an auto knife = one hand deployment. Sure, you can do this with the Spyderco hole but it is so much quicker and easier with the button. Plus, in quite a few combat situations, you have big work gloves on that make it easier to mash a button than to plug your fingertip into a hole. I haven't had any issues with the reliability, but I take good care of it also.

[KaliGman]

SlideTechnik, I think auto Spyderco knives are some of the best in the industry. I have used a bunch of different brands and Spyderco has really done a great job. Biggest benefit for an auto knife = one hand deployment. Sure, you can do this with the Spyderco hole but it is so much quicker and easier with the button. Plus, in quite a few combat situations, you have big work gloves on that make it easier to mash a button than to plug your fingertip into a hole. I haven't had any issues with the reliability, but I take good care of it also.

I have owned autos. I still own two--both collector pieces. Having done quite a few years training in and teaching the combative uses of knives and how to defend against knives, as well as having been "out in the real world" and getting in quite a few scrapes in over 17 years of law enforcement, I have found the advantages of automatic knives to be exactly--NONE. I have never worn gloves that were heavy enough to keep me from deploying a larger Spyderco (such as a Military) while engaged in law enforcement--and that includes when wearing Nomex gloves in SWAT operations. Also, after years of doing combative stuff with knives, I have come to the conclusion that the Spyderco "Spyderhole" opening system is far more reliable under stress than is the button on an auto. Autos can be used defensively and in everyday cutting. I just find them more toys than tools in my usage, and far less reliable and slower in deployment than a Spyderco Military, ATR, Barong, etc.

[Ed Schempp]

A couple of my friends are glass guys or glazers. They found the automatic knife to be handy when they would do installations of replacements glass. They had to develop a habit of deploying the blade with the opening toward the ground. They ran into the problem of hitting the glass with a quick releasing blade.

I turned these guys onto waved Delicas and they haven't carried the autos since...Take care...Ed

[nuubee]

I don't normally visit this area, but just happened to notice that the most recent post was by Ed Schempp, so I thought I'd check it out. I think that civilians here in Oregon may be able to own - but not carry concealed - auto folders, but I have never been tempted to possess one. I have a hard time conceiving of an appreciable speed difference over a regular Spydiehole, and what seems more important, springs that are left either 'stretched', or 'compressed' over long periods of time, tend to lose their 'springiness' (Mr. Schempp, please excuse my imprecise language). Since the spring of a closed auto folder is left 'stretched' most of the time, it might cause some of the same theoretical problems encountered as leaving a firearm magazine fully loaded for long periods of time. Do military/LE people ever leave their auto folders open while they are sleeping, just to give the spring a rest, just as people are supposed to rotate which of their magazines they keep loaded? I'm not denying the 'bling' factor (a corrections officer once let me play with his), but spring 'tensility issues' would concern me. I have read that in the years before the New York gang violence became a public issue in the '50s, that there were companies that made sporting switchblades for hunters in duck blinds with cold, wet fingers, and that there were also fancy, feminine switchblades with chased/embossed sterling silver handles for ladies' sewing kits, so that they wouldn't have to risk chipping a fingernail...

[The Deacon]

I've had a few times that it's so cold, I lost most of the motor skills in my hand, one hand opening a blade with either hole or stud is out of the question, even open an assisted opener is doubtful. I'd imagine push a button would be possible in that situation, but since I can't have one I won't be able to find out.

Ok, that's valid to some extent, but it presumes that you'd be willing to carry one without the safety engaged. With numb hands and the mental state which normally accompanies them, I'd think the chances of "premature discharge" would at least as high as those of being able to deploy it intentionally.

I have read that in the years before the New York gang violence became a public issue in the '50s, that there were companies that made sporting switchblades for hunters in duck blinds with cold, wet fingers, and that there were also fancy, feminine switchblades with chased/embossed sterling silver handles for ladies' sewing kits, so that they wouldn't have to risk chipping a fingernail...

The two original "target audiences" for automatics in the late 1800's were amputees, of which there were a sizable number prior to weapons technology advancing at a faster pace than medical science, and "the fair sex", to protect their fingernails when sewing, sharpening a pencil, or making/repairing a quill pen. Yes, incredible as it sounds, genteel schoolgirls once carried these evil implements into the classroom. :eek: :D

For the record, the "connection" between automatics and gang violence in New York City and elsewhere was almost pure fiction created by yellow journalists in order to sell papers. Baseball bats and lengths of chain (sometimes with a padlock on the end), and iron pipe just didn't make great villains, since they're darn hard to "do something about".

[nuubee]

Fascinating, Deacon. Thank you for the information.