Anyone else concerned?

[TkoK83Spy]

As usual, I really think David hit the nail on the head with his post. Tough to disagree with any of that.

[James Y]

I also have a spyderco collection. So I understand whats being said.

But I also think its a little bit ridiculous.

I could go the rest of my knife with a vg10 endura and a couple salts and be just fine.

I personally prefer spydercos main lineup much much more than some potential new exotic design. Military, pm2, shaman, native chief, endura, police 4.... these are already my perfect knives. They are why I choose spyderco.

How many ways can you reinvent the wheel???
From a completely utilitarian point of view theres almost no difference between locking folding knife A and locking folding knife B.

I sort of get it.
The auto industry doesnt make the truck I want... but they do make trucks.
The motorcycle industry doesnt make the motorcycle I want... but they do make motorcycles.

I guess what Im saying here is any product in any industry is a compromise.

^^This.^^

Jim

[Mini2white]

I usually buy variations on knives I like (no pm2 or para3 ) plus vintage models. Most new ones just don't do it for me. I find vintage models are better value. The Kapara was the most exciting new model to sit in my hand.

[aicolainen]

My first post didn’t really approach the topic in a meaningful way, it was more to put some weight on the scale, and help it tip a little more in the direction of re-runs. Not to the same extent as new designs, but don’t totally forget about them either. Like with music, some of the best pieces are already made, but we have to play the old records again from time to time, so the new audience has a chance to discover them.

That little prayer aside, I have no intention on telling Spyderco how to run their business.
Though them selling lots of sprints and exclusives of bread and butter models might feel like it’s getting in the way of new and “more interesting” designs, it could actually be that it creates more opportunity for exotic and risky projects in the long run. Profit is freedom to follow your passion.

With everything going on atm, I’m not expecting anyone to work miracles and bring new designs to market in record time, but I’m not concerned about Spyderco’s intentions.
With everything revealed, but still unreleased, the prototypes they showed at blade show, rumored and semi-confirmed new designs and updates, I’m more concerned I won’t be able to buy/try everything that looks promising/appealing than anything else.

[curlyhairedboy]

I've seen a pattern occur a few times:

New model with a new design is teased, causing great anticipation amongst the spider-knuts.

New model with a new design is finalized with one of Spyderco's standard steel/handle combinations. Some afi's interest drops off as "I don't need any more knives in S30v/I can't take any more black G10" sentiments start to be posted.

New model with a new design has retail pricing announced, and another significant fraction of afi's says they're out: "I can't justify paying $XXX for this....if only this was in micarta/tool steel/vanax/titanium."

New model with a new design hits the market and doesn't sell out.

New model with a new design starts being bundled by retailers to bypass MAP and move stock.

New model with a new design is discontinued, and immediately discounted by retailers.

Sprints of existing models fill the needs of all of the afi's who wanted their dream version. For models with very broad appeal, the market depth for sprints is very hard to exhaust.

Retailers also love the opportunity to distinguish themselves by sponsoring various flavors.

If you can virtually guarantee that a production run will sell out without any massive changes to tooling, that's a good move.

[Naperville]

I read every post. Some interesting thoughts.

I feel that you cannot blame Spyderco for being Spyderco. Even Spyderco's entry on Wikipedia denotes a strong relationship between models and a variety of esoteric steels. Every model is meant to speak to someone, but not all. It is impossible to speak to everyone with one design, one implementation, one steel. If the knives are like wind chimes then their tones are like the different releases.

I'm not here to complain about the variety of releases/sprints with different steels and grip colors/materials, not after Spyderco brought my attention to the Native Chief! I had never tried to collect all of any one model, and so far I am enjoying what they have created. I'm lucky to have the funds at this time to keep up. They are beautiful and useful tools for self defense.

I'm a very happy customer. I'm lucky to be alive to have something that gives me something to think about other than the world. It takes my mind away to an age and practice that Spyderco has mastered, but so few others have.

Everyone wants what they want until the magic happens.

Keep on Keepin on Spyderco!

[Qcrazy]

Interesting question, I’ve been a huge Spyderco fan early on. I’ve amassed a fairly large collection though really since the Military craze; I have lost much of my passion. Please don’t get me wrong, I think that the Military, Paramilitary, and the Para 3 are great knives. Just not for me.
I started collecting Spydercos for their oddity. From the Worker, all the Q’s, the R, to the Meerkat they hooked me good. Then the ethnic series with the Persians, Kris, Ayoob, and others I was in deep. All the Natives still interest me and I’ve collected most. The Mules are great for getting to play with exotic steels. Any and all of the small knives leapt into my collection too.
My preferences run to 3 inch or less in blade length. Most of what I see seems to be coming out these days are either larger than I like or of the Military persuasion. It could be that my tastes have changed and knives have become less a part of my life, though even today I’m gifting a Native to another friend that has shown an interest in knives. This will be the fifth Native gifted this year and the second of the week, because to me this is a great entry level quality Spyderco knife. That it is made in Golden Colorado is a plus too since non knife people in the U.S. unknowingly and wrongly dismiss knives made elsewhere. Just yesterday I sent my brother to the Outlet for knives and he and his wife brought home 4 Dragonflys and some chef knives for Christmas presents.
To me Spyderco has to walk a fine line. They’ve always been known for inventiveness and progress, though must too meet a bottom line. The way I see sales of the Military line increase with high end steels and scale offerings so many clamor for, as a business that’s what I’d be offering. The companies that now offer specialty Spyderco’s via exclusives have become such sought after items, others are copying their success. Anyone that’s been around for a while can attest, many of the oddities so many of us enjoy end up not selling well and are soon discontinued.
I still visit both the Spyderco forum and the Blades forum daily, search Ebay and the folder sales on Bladesforum often too, though seldom buy anymore. I’ve sold some of my collection, wondering how a few knives morphed into hundreds and kick myself at times for the obsession. When selling, once I handle a knife again for pictures and write-up the love comes back and pre-sellers remorse raises its ugly head and many times the knife goes back into storage.
I sure don’t have answers. I really enjoy the community of the forums and I’ll continue to prowl the sites. I’m thankful that I found a company that makes something that I like and that they do it very well.

I've posted on both forums. Thanks for the question and Sal and Company for their insight. Dan

[zhyla]

My main concern with Spyderco is they’ve priced themselves out of ordinary people’s pockets. All I see is a company that caters to enthusiasts. That’s fine, but I’m bummed that none of my friends will ever carry a Spyderco when the cheaper options are so good.

[Ramonade]

Some of the posts (really well thought of and that i agree with) might be boilled down to the fact that there is a forum.
Brands that do not have a forum would not have that quantity of commentaries on each of their actions.
Moreover, the forumites are particular customers, fans really, and their view of Spyderco is often idealized.

When you love something or someone, you want it to be the perfect picture you painted in your mind ^^

[Naperville]

NOTE! For my income I'd say that I collect a lot of knives, but did not have too many Spydercos until recently. I have 13 Spyderco knives out of around 95 knives over almost 4 years, so 13% of my knives are Spyderco. Some of the knives I'm still acquiring a taste for. I'm used to just purchasing fixed blades and have quite a few, maybe 80% of my knives are fixed blades with boring steels, typical design. I still need a Respect, that is the one fixed blade I am seeking.

Initially I started with a Military in 110V, but I was not smitten with the hump on the top of the blade. I started to buy up Spyderco fixed blades and I have a few. But all along I had my eye on the 4 inch Native Chief. Strange enough, I still do not have the S30V model, but plan to acquire it next month. I have all of the other Native Chiefs. The knife looks like it just came out of an Architectural Design monthly. Because I'm on a limited fixed income, I try to save for the Sprints that Spyderco has because if I like the knife and do not have the funds, I'm SOL.

The Native Chief is the only model that I tried to buy all of the knives in that model. I feel like, HEY! They are making the model that I like....my number has come up, so I try to save to make sure that I get every one. Do I want more? Heck yes!!! I think we still need an M390/204P/20CV, Maxamet, Magnacut, LC200n, ...

I'm here for BOTH, the designs and the steels, Sal, Eric and Michael being good guys is whip cream on the top.

I'm not much of a Spyder-Nut, if only 13% of the knives that I have are Spydercos. New designs can be thrilling. In fact I still want an Ichuchi and Shaman, just have not had the cash on me when I was going to pull the trigger. I am afraid to just buy knives willy nilly now because of the FOMO on Native Chiefs!

Spydercos approach seems even handed, they need to do both release new knives when they can, and concentrate on the sprints.

[dj moonbat]

Almost all of the designers of the Spydercos I like best already work for/with Spyderco.

But if there's a way to get an Enrique Pena project going, I'm in.

[bleasure]

idk man capitalism's a **** of a drug. you gotta constantly grow just to stay the same size, keep a house, feed yourself and yr bairns. knives are cool, and useful - specifically in that order when it comes to hobbyists/collectors/etc. but everyone here knows that beyond what are already well-recognized specialty forms for specific tasks or professions, most people could get by very effectively with a single general purpose knife or two depending on their needs, in like, 440C steel, for their entire lives. as (like we love to remind people) t h o u s a n d s of years of using the ~oldest tool~ have shown, if nothing else.

the differentiation of models has nothing to do with what the fables tell us about "market efficiency," bc if "the market" worked like the giant informatic truth engine its poet laureates wax on about there would be comparatively fewer variations than exist today, not more. they are simply not necessary. the proliferation of models and variations within them has, after a certain point, a lot more to do with the logic of capital at a point in history where branding - production organized by notions of "identity" and "lifestyle" - has been the dominant mode of marketing and consumer-oriented business for like going on 50 years, than the mythic natural order that the invisible hand, competitive advantage, data science etc. supposedly represent and/or produce.

in other words, regardless of whether its a parade of new designer collabs or seemingly endless rearrangements of basic components on the same models, the *extreme* differentiation across knife production in general kinda boils down to the imperatives to produce more, more efficiently, that have governed productive activity since feudalism started to dissolve on some English farms in the 16th century. the shape that takes depends on the social and historical realities of the place and time. currently, the tendency to buy something that has to do with 'who you are' vs. like, professional needs is especially prononunced in the market for folding knives, and the different allegiances to X steel, color, design etc is a reflection of that much more than the practical realities of what different knives can do and are for. among other things (like laws, etc.)

so imo what we end up seeing is a mix of personal interest that the folks in this and similar companies have - the basic human love of making stuff - mingling with and at times conflicting with the extremely clear market imperatives that have organized "economic" behavior for the past 500 years. the personal, creative element is sometimes more pronounced in private companies like this one, which are run by what are ultimately designers who do what they love within the constraints they face. the forum in general, and certainly this post, are sort of a technology of info capture for market research re: the latter point at the end of the day, even if it's also true that they can't at all be reduced to only that.

i guess what i'm saying is i think new and different knives are great, but so are knives that are made with ingredients i personally appreciate...lol. i mean my three fav spydercos are now the wolfspyder, stretch 2, and brouwer, two of which are obviously designer models that have been discontinued. would also be cool to maybe see knives that are produced in comparatively novel ways - using reclaimed ingredients, unionized labor, etc, esp. given the energy or ecological costs of iron/steel and synthetics production. but that's barking up a whole 'nother tree that i know doesn't have a whole lot of sympathy in these parts

[murphjd25]

Coming out of the Covid thing, it’s all about that bread and butter right now, and that happens to be hot exclusives and new variations of old models. Plus, I don’t think many other people then us knife afis buy any of the newer collabs and designs either, because those usually start pushing the price way up. I wouldn’t be concerned, they seem to be doing just fine.

[bearrowland]

I'm very happy with my small collection of user Spyderco knives. I could go the rest of my life with my PM2 and Endura, and not miss a beat but I love the interaction of Spyderco and their customers here. My son, a more avid collector of knives than I am, was talking to me tonight about the knife business. Unlike some firms located much closer to me, at least Spyderco looks constantly into the new and untried, and you'll not find a friendlier bunch of fans than the good people here! I've not had that experience in other company forums. I use my knives for work and play, and I push my PM2 hard and strong and it keeps coming back without so much of a blemish. Am I good for long term business? Yes and no. I'll buy Spyderco knives exclusively but the ones I have keep me happy! I do long for the early days (before I was a customer!) when the knives took a much more creative stance look wise...the Ayoob knife amongst others. I guess I'll take reissues of the early knives more so than new designs just because I'm nostalgic for a time that I missed when Spyderco was new and very Avant Gard design wise.

[Skywalker]

I'm not concerned. I like the sprints/exclusives of established models, letting me try new steels in designs I know I like, and there's still plenty of the "designer" models that I haven't gotten around to yet but I'm interested in. And I work in the auto industry; I'm not holding 2020-2021 slowdowns against anyone else in the manufacturing business, hah.


For perspective, though, I'm only buying a handful of Spydercos a year. If I was like OP, with 150 Spydercos that he describes as having "complied a pretty decent collection of Spyderco knives in a very short period of time", maybe I'd be bored too.

[Road Tripper]

At heart, a knife is a simple concept, and doesn't even need to be steel. I appreciate the different designs that Spyderco delivers, with outside designers or not, but would be very interested in the journey behind the designs, and not just in the 'destination.' I'm thinking, for instance, of the insight video with Gayle Bradley. I'd love to see videos like that with Sal, Eric, or other designers. For example, I found the discussion of how the Delica wharncliffe came to be quite interesting, and a video summing all that up would be illuminating. I'd like to hear Sal talk about the Shaman design too, and how it evolved. How about the thinking behind the relatively boxy scales on some knives? Is it due to economics, ergonomics, or perhaps a mixture? I think that kind of content would help spark new discussions, and lead to new designs.

I trust that the Spyderco folks know what they're doing, and I'll keep looking at models that interest me. After all, I haven't found the perfect knife yet!

[sal]

I really appreciate all of the comments and I appreciate the OP for re-posting it here.

Spyderco has evolved over a 40+ year period. As we evolved, we found that our market was changing and growing in a variety of areas. We have to balance some pretty diverse groups and that balance is always changing. Especially as new markets emerge. Suddenly we have a collector market. Suddenly we have a variety of collector markets. Suddenly we have Steel Junky's, Exclusives, Sprints, add capacity issues with most of our factories and partners.

We also have to plan for the future; how do we serve these markets? How do we deal with the higher costs without running to China? How many "new" models do we want to gamble with? Knowing that some will not last and we might not even recoup our tooling? rankly, it is a "puzzlement" that we are always juggling. That's why I wanted and appreciate a larger group of responses.

Most of the innovations are born in-house. Models like the Shaman took years to develop, and the two other variations are still waiting for a production slot. Shamans, "Roadies", Slipits take time to get them right enough to put into production. Even now, we have a number of new innovations that have been in development for years.

Threads like this one give us good input to think of while going forward.

sal

[sal]

Hey Barry,

If you have questions about the history and development and thoughts of certain models, best to ask here. Also many others will get to hear the answers.

sal

[ZrowsN1s]

I like a mix of new designs, and re-hash.

There is no knife I am looking more forward to than the Triple B Handmade (aka Deadboxhero) collab. That's a new design, and a new collab.

Also looking forward to the Performance Delica when it comes. A new twist on a classic. On a related note I really wish the Tanto and Wharncliffe PM2'S had been standard production not exclusives. Would have meant more exclusive and sprint variations down the road. As is, great designs are forever base models in short supply, with maybe 'a' variation in shorter supply.

I'd like to see knives liked the P'kal restocked, and the Lil' P'kal put into production, though I know they are more of a service to the community than a profit generator.

I am ever hopeful for a G-10 or Carbon Fiber PE Hawkbill Dragonfly Sprint. S90V, K390, or....

Unless it's one of my pretty specific variations on an old design, or the re-release of a disco'd knife I missed out on, you're more likely to get me to try a new model, especially if it's made in Golden.

[RamZar]

There are some models that should've never made it to production. For instance, this year's Viele Phoenix Sprint Run with VG-10 and Red G-10 for a MAP price of $315! As much as I like the Taichung knives many fall into the same category. Spyderco produces one batch and done with many being sold when discontinued.