Explanation of grounds? Which is your favorite?

[crispeto]

I'm a little fuzzy about the different grounds. Can someone tell me the difference between hollow ground, saber ground, and full flat ground? Of these, which is your favorite and why? Thanks.

[The Deacon]

Check out this page, scroll down to "Grinds". I personally prefer a full flat grind. Simplest, cleanest, look, cuts well for both shallow and deep cuts.

[The Mentaculous]

I think the type of grind is not quite as important as it's made out to be--all of them can be excellent, as long as they are done with thin enough geometry, and they all have good qualities for different applications.

I personally like a high hollow grind, or a FFG, as they both provide good edge geometry.

[Blerv]

I like many hollow grinds as they suit my needs and have a slightly more aggressive look. However, FFG is a great grind and prob more balanced for all tasks.

I'd love to try a Scandi or a Chisel grind tho :)

[kawr]

My favorite is FFG for that nice smooth, clean look and the way it slices and cuts. That being said a properly done high hollow grind is right up there with FFG for me.

[Evil D]

For me it really depends on the knife and intended use. I like thick hearty blades, so for that i tend to like FFG better since you can have a thick blade and still have decent slicing ability (ala Paramilitary/Military/Para 2 etc). For thinner blades i like saber grind...not many people like that grind but on something like a Delica i think it's a great grind that doesn't leave the knife feeling fragile in your hand and you don't have to worry about breaking the tip. I don't have much experience with hollow grinds but on the ones i've used i wasn't much of a fan...when cutting certain media they tend to "steer" in funny directions. They're good for keeping a blade strong but thin behind the edge but IMO don't make for a very good slicer on rigid materials like corrugated.

[Dr. Snubnose]

It's double zero ground for me...Doc :D

[Slash]

depends on what you're cuttin'. but, for some reason many upscale and customs are hollow. i.e. sebenza, strider, etc.

imo convex would be the toughest. it's also the easiest to maintain a sharp edge through stroping.

[Dr. Snubnose]

I like many hollow grinds as they suit my needs and have a slightly more aggressive look. However, FFG is a great grind and prob more balanced for all tasks.

I'd love to try a Scandi or a Chisel grind tho :)

Chisel grind cuts like a light saber plus....and I have a few....and they cut like nothing else....two things I don't like about them....1) They can't cut straight and 2) I can't get past the look and thought that somebody just cut corners and didn't have the patience or good sense to do the other side.....must come from my experience with cheap cheap knives with the chisel grind....that being said all those in my current collection cut just fine.....but I still can't get over the feeling that somethings missing...LOL...Doc :D

[dialex]

I preffer a convex grind, but in the end it all depends on the knife itself.

[Blerv]

Thanks Doc! Yea I heard about that but am overweaming logic with quirkiness :) . Good call Dialex on the convex, love to try one done right.

[jackknifeh]

A knife is made to cut and the thinner the blade is the better and easier it will go through whatever you are cutting. That is why my favorite grind is the FFG. So my question is why are there other grinds. I would think it would be to give the blade more strength against side to side movement. You shouldn’t use a knife blade to pry a hub cap off to change your tire but most knives used will have pressure put on them from side to side movement. Cutting wood would be a good example of this on a camping trip. So I think the hollow grind would be a better choice because the thicker spine will give the blade more durability and still provide the thinner blade for a portion of the blade. The saber grind will add a little more durability towards the edge but the blade gets thicker faster which will hinder the cutting some.

The times a grind doesn’t matter at all is when cutting string, small rope or anything very thin. Cardboard is thick because I am talking about the length of the cut, not how thick the cardboard is. If more of the blade than just the edge touches the material the grind might make a difference in ease or performance.

That’s the way it seems to me. Thinner is better for cutting. Thicken the blade to increase side to side durability when needed. From a knife maker’s point of view (I don’t know anything about making knives) it would seem easier to make a FFG blade because of less angles or curves.

Jack

[The Deacon]

Depends on what you're cutting Jack. There is simply no such thing as a universally superior grind. Each has its strong and weak points because, even though all knifes are "made to cut" some are purpose built to cut certain things, or cut in certain ways.

Full hollow, for example, is the grind of choice for straight razors for a number of reasons. The blade can be kept very thin for a good distance behind the edge, which is acceptable because even the most wiry of facial hair is still pretty thin and soft. It also allows the blade to be sharpened easily by restiing both the edge and the "spine" against the stone, and allows a lot of resharpening before thickness behind the edge becomes a factor. Convex, on the other hand gives the strongest edge, great for chopping, not so good for making sushi.

Even a full flat grind's ability to cut well involves four factors, and grind is only one of them. Blade thickness, blade height, and thickness behind the edge all contribute. Thinner behind the edge is better, and between two blades the same thickness behind the edge, the one that's thinner at the spine will be better assuming equal height. If the everything else is equal, then the taller of the two will be better. Of course, the tradeoff here is that the "better" cutter is also the "weaker" blade, so it's not going to work for everyone.

[jackknifeh]

Depends on what you're cutting Jack. There is simply no such thing as a universally superior grind. Each has its strong and weak points because, even though all knifes are "made to cut" some are purpose built to cut certain things, or cut in certain ways.

Full hollow, for example, is the grind of choice for straight razors for a number of reasons. The blade can be kept very thin for a good distance behind the edge, which is acceptable because even the most wiry of facial hair is still pretty thin and soft. It also allows the blade to be sharpened easily by restiing both the edge and the "spine" against the stone, and allows a lot of resharpening before thickness behind the edge becomes a factor. Convex, on the other hand gives the strongest edge, great for chopping, not so good for making sushi.

Even a full flat grind's ability to cut well involves four factors, and grind is only one of them. Blade thickness, blade height, and thickness behind the edge all contribute. Thinner behind the edge is better, and between two blades the same thickness behind the edge, the one that's thinner at the spine will be better assuming equal height. If the everything else is equal, then the taller of the two will be better. Of course, the tradeoff here is that the "better" cutter is also the "weaker" blade, so it's not going to work for everyone.

Great info. That is exactly what I was looking for when I asked "why other grinds" other than full flat. Especially the thin behind the edge thing. I tried a to create a convex edge once the best I could since I don't have a belt sander. I used the Edge Pro and put an 18 per side angle on the very edge, then lowered the angle to 16, 14, 12 and the last angle per side was 10. It created an edge, then 4 back bevels. I was proud of it because I had each bevel the same width. I should have left it alone but I decided to hit the edge on the odd number angles and when I was done I had a narly looking monstrosity on the edge of a beautiful Endura. So back to the single back bevel and micro bevel which has become my norm.

I have learned a lot from you and others in the last year or two about sharpening. I don't mind saying I've whittled away an amount of steel that gladly has paid off. That's one thing I never considered, sharpening your blade away. Now once I get an edge where I want it I can bring back a great edge with just a minute or two and loosing almost no blade. Just don't let any knife get really dull.

Jack

[pl4stic]

Full flat, less resistance when cutting through something thick than a low hollow or low flat.

[Blerv]

The cool thing about hollow-grinds is that with a similar width of blade stock the edge sharpens easier. That goes back to what Deacon said about material behind the edge.

As you sharpen a FFG the angle increases much faster than a HG (again, apples to apples).

http://www.spyderco.com/forums/attachme ... 1193923230

#1 vs #2. For half the edge life it's on par or beating FFG. Once it recedes that much (after who knows how much sharpening? :eek :) you could technically take the HG to a grinder and thin it out. More likely you would throw the knife out.

FFG shines with a thinner overall thickness and a less gradual ramping thickness. That makes it terrific for materials like cardboard and perhaps worse for softer ones like flesh.

Usually we compare apples to oranges. A Delica saber-grind vs a Cento3, or a Krein/Southard FFG treatment which does more than simply convert # 1 to #2.