CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
- Deadboxhero
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CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
I did an "out of box" test in a video here
62rc, stroped the factory edge and measured it for angles and sharpness on the BESS tester as seen in the video.
I put my own edge on it using some metallic cbn stones to set the edge and resin diamond waterstones to polish followed by stroping.
I'd be curious to play on some regular ceramic abrasive waterstones to compare, the vanadium/niobium carbides seem to be at low enough volume as to not interfere with sharpening but I'll have to test and see.
My initial impression is that the steel wants to get sharp.
If I could only use one word to describe it I'd say "Crisp"
I've noticed over they years that different steels have their own character at the edge, some being more aggressive and "bitey", some more keen, and some really gummy and difficult to deburr.
So I was stoked to see the edge come up crispy with bite rather than purely on the smoother solely keen side like Vtoku 2
I especially enjoyed how pleasant this steel was to deburr. Steels like Bd1, 8cr13Mov aren't very pleasant to deburr and are morre on the gummy side and can come up smoother at the edge.
The edge character reminds me of Sg2/R2/SGPS, Srs-15, Lam CoS.
Too soon to say more.
So far, I'm very happy.
-Shawn
*Update 01/12/2021
S30v vs Spy27
The goal of the cut testing was to discern the difference between these two steels compared directly, it is not to say that folks will get exactly x amount of cuts in their personal use but to distinguish between the two different steels in cutting edge retention with slicing rope.
The test used is a modified version of Phil Wilson's Rope cut test but with a fixed amount of cuts and with sharpeness measured before and after the cutting
The knife with the lowest sharpeness value in grams at the end of the test is the winner.
Differences in controlled testing may be marginal to what some folks experience anecdotally since there are more variables for users in the wild especially with the sharpening differences between different users etc.
For example,
If steel X cuts less in controlled testing but is easier to sharpen than steel Y for one user than they may feel it has better edge holding due to starting sharper for them and their ability and techniques.
The Test
Both knives were at
12°dps, 0.025"bte
Same angle and edge width
400grit CBN, no strop.
Both started at 109grams BESS sharpeness.
Rope used was 3/4 Manilla full braid
Moisture of rope was 11.6%
Rope was dried at 300°F for 20min
Moisture after was 0.0% and confirmed by comparison to non dried piece.
Starting cut weight both the same at 7lbs, the drier rope combined with the 0.025" behind the edge thickness increased the pounds needed to slice back and forth and separate the rope.
Than if the rope was at 11.6% moisture and if the behind the edge thickness was narrower.
7 slices per cut to separate the rope.
20 cuts total, 14lbs of force needed to slice by last cut in 0.0% moisture rope.
The drier rope significantly affected the edge wear
Versus when tested at 11.6% moisture and was significantly more difficult to cut.
11.6% moisture rope had a lower lbs needed to slice the rope at 5lbs to start versus 7lbs on the 0.0% moisture rope, also the 11.6% moisture rope only needed 9lbs to slice after 20 cuts
End result
0.0% moisture rope
S30v
397g BESS
SPY27
538g BESS
11.6% Moisture rope
S30v
268g
SPY27
298g
S30v had a better BESS sharpeness score after 20 slicing cuts in 3/4 manila rope with and without moisture with the same edge angle and behind the edge thickness and starting BESS sharpeness despite being slightly softer in HRC due to higher carbide volume of harder carbide particles at the edge.
Next test is edge stability with a polished edge.
62rc, stroped the factory edge and measured it for angles and sharpness on the BESS tester as seen in the video.
I put my own edge on it using some metallic cbn stones to set the edge and resin diamond waterstones to polish followed by stroping.
I'd be curious to play on some regular ceramic abrasive waterstones to compare, the vanadium/niobium carbides seem to be at low enough volume as to not interfere with sharpening but I'll have to test and see.
My initial impression is that the steel wants to get sharp.
If I could only use one word to describe it I'd say "Crisp"
I've noticed over they years that different steels have their own character at the edge, some being more aggressive and "bitey", some more keen, and some really gummy and difficult to deburr.
So I was stoked to see the edge come up crispy with bite rather than purely on the smoother solely keen side like Vtoku 2
I especially enjoyed how pleasant this steel was to deburr. Steels like Bd1, 8cr13Mov aren't very pleasant to deburr and are morre on the gummy side and can come up smoother at the edge.
The edge character reminds me of Sg2/R2/SGPS, Srs-15, Lam CoS.
Too soon to say more.
So far, I'm very happy.
-Shawn
*Update 01/12/2021
S30v vs Spy27
The goal of the cut testing was to discern the difference between these two steels compared directly, it is not to say that folks will get exactly x amount of cuts in their personal use but to distinguish between the two different steels in cutting edge retention with slicing rope.
The test used is a modified version of Phil Wilson's Rope cut test but with a fixed amount of cuts and with sharpeness measured before and after the cutting
The knife with the lowest sharpeness value in grams at the end of the test is the winner.
Differences in controlled testing may be marginal to what some folks experience anecdotally since there are more variables for users in the wild especially with the sharpening differences between different users etc.
For example,
If steel X cuts less in controlled testing but is easier to sharpen than steel Y for one user than they may feel it has better edge holding due to starting sharper for them and their ability and techniques.
The Test
Both knives were at
12°dps, 0.025"bte
Same angle and edge width
400grit CBN, no strop.
Both started at 109grams BESS sharpeness.
Rope used was 3/4 Manilla full braid
Moisture of rope was 11.6%
Rope was dried at 300°F for 20min
Moisture after was 0.0% and confirmed by comparison to non dried piece.
Starting cut weight both the same at 7lbs, the drier rope combined with the 0.025" behind the edge thickness increased the pounds needed to slice back and forth and separate the rope.
Than if the rope was at 11.6% moisture and if the behind the edge thickness was narrower.
7 slices per cut to separate the rope.
20 cuts total, 14lbs of force needed to slice by last cut in 0.0% moisture rope.
The drier rope significantly affected the edge wear
Versus when tested at 11.6% moisture and was significantly more difficult to cut.
11.6% moisture rope had a lower lbs needed to slice the rope at 5lbs to start versus 7lbs on the 0.0% moisture rope, also the 11.6% moisture rope only needed 9lbs to slice after 20 cuts
End result
0.0% moisture rope
S30v
397g BESS
SPY27
538g BESS
11.6% Moisture rope
S30v
268g
SPY27
298g
S30v had a better BESS sharpeness score after 20 slicing cuts in 3/4 manila rope with and without moisture with the same edge angle and behind the edge thickness and starting BESS sharpeness despite being slightly softer in HRC due to higher carbide volume of harder carbide particles at the edge.
Next test is edge stability with a polished edge.
Last edited by Deadboxhero on Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:52 am, edited 4 times in total.
- Surfingringo
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
Interesting! That initial report has me interested! I am a big fan of steels that have a more aggressive edge characteristic at any given grit. That’s actually why Cruwear is one of my favorites to sharpen. It’s not just that it “wants to get sharp” as you say, but it maintains its aggression even into higher grit finishes.
I’ll probably pick up one of the lightweights in this steel soon.
I’ll probably pick up one of the lightweights in this steel soon.
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
Thanks Shawn! Good to hear!
I'll be waiting (praying) for a Military.
I'll be waiting (praying) for a Military.
Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
Tonight's trash night at my house. So I used my SPY27 Para 3 to cut up several more boxes. Kind of surprised by how much cardboard I've cut with the factory edge. It was still cutting nicely but definitely not shaving sharp anymore. So I decided to go ahead and touch it up on the Sharpmaker. The edge came up nicely on the medium stones and it was popping arm hair in no time. Whittles hardwood nicely too. My first impression was it wants to get really sharp and it does feel like it has a nice bite. Then I read Shawn's post and was happy to see he thought the same.
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
Now this is the kind of evaluation I'm looking for. Thanks triple-B
Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
Cool.
I wonder how good this steel would be for a outdoor fixed blade knife.
I wonder how good this steel would be for a outdoor fixed blade knife.
In the pocket: Chaparral FRN, Native Chief, Police 4 K390, Pacific Salt SE, Manix 2 G10 REX45
- FullScaler
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
As soon as they start shipping those mules we will find out. :D
Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
I am such a moron :D Completly forgot about Mule.FullScaler wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 12:14 amAs soon as they start shipping those mules we will find out. :D
In the pocket: Chaparral FRN, Native Chief, Police 4 K390, Pacific Salt SE, Manix 2 G10 REX45
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
Lol, I refresh the mule page in the Spyderco shop every day waiting for it to launch. :PPancake wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 12:29 amI am such a moron :D Completly forgot about Mule.FullScaler wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 12:14 amAs soon as they start shipping those mules we will find out. :D
Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
Thanks heaps for your insight, Shawn!
I’ll be most interested to learn more. :)
I’ll be most interested to learn more. :)
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- curlyhairedboy
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
Sounds very promising!
EDC Rotation: PITS, Damasteel Urban, Shaman, Ikuchi, Amalgam, CruCarta Shaman, Sage 5 LW, Serrated Caribbean Sheepsfoot CQI, XHP Shaman, M4/Micarta Shaman, 15v Shaman
Fixed Blades: Proficient, Magnacut Mule
Special and Sentimental: Southard, Squarehead LW, Ouroboros, Calendar Para 3 LW, 40th Anniversary Native, Ti Native, Calendar Watu, Tanto PM2
Would like to own again: CQI Caribbean Sheepsfoot PE, Watu
Wishlist: Magnacut, Shaman Sprints!
Fixed Blades: Proficient, Magnacut Mule
Special and Sentimental: Southard, Squarehead LW, Ouroboros, Calendar Para 3 LW, 40th Anniversary Native, Ti Native, Calendar Watu, Tanto PM2
Would like to own again: CQI Caribbean Sheepsfoot PE, Watu
Wishlist: Magnacut, Shaman Sprints!
- Doc Dan
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
I am really interested to see how it stacks up to other steels performance wise.
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Spydernation 0050
Follow the Christ, the King,
Live pure, speak true, right wrong, follow the King--
Else, wherefore born?" (Tennyson)
NRA Life Member
Spydernation 0050
Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
I can't wait for the mule!
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
I've been refreshing the mule page on the SFO site like 5x a day :)
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
Love that strop. Smooth, firm and high quality. One of these days when I can afford it I need to get a few metallic CBN and Resin diamond stones. I have gotten back in the grove of free hand sharpening thanks to advice Shawn has given me. I don’t see myself going back to to anything else. I started my journey year’s ago at a very young age freehand sharpening and that is how my journey will end one day year’s from now.
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
From what I am reading on Knife Steel Nerds site, it seems to be in the middle of its peer group, with the exception of ease of sharpening which looks to be better than S30V & S35V. That seems like good news for people like me.
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Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
I’ll be interested to see how this steel performs over time.
Jim
Jim
Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
I cut up a fair amount of cardboard last night with my SPY-27 Para3 (and a couple other knives) after just giving it a quick stropping out of the box, as it had a better than average factory edge on it, it did excellent IMO... I took it to my SharpMaker afterwards and it's very easy to sharpen, it reminds me very much of sharpening SuperGold2 or XHP, and edge retention seemed better than I expected as well - better than VG10, BD1, BD1N or V-Toku2, I'd say somewhere in the neighbourhood of S30V or SuperGold2... although this was a fairly minor experiment I think at this point if it's going to replace VG10 it's a great upgrade and a little lesser upgrade from S30V... can't say anything more specific other than I'm impressed and it exceeded all my expectations. I'm looking forward to using it allot more, and the Native5 LW & Manix2 LW are 100% on my 'to get' list...
Cheers,
John
Cheers,
John
Re: CPM SPY27 | Edge Performance
Cycletroll wrote: ↑Sun Jun 14, 2020 5:59 pmThanks Shawn! Good to hear!
I'll be waiting (praying) for a Military.
THAT would be a dream spydie for me :spyder: Cobalt blue G10 handle of course :eek:
Marius
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Proud member of the old school spyderedge nation
" A mind all logic is like a knife all blade. It makes the hand bleed that uses it "
( Rabindranath Tagore )
Proud member of the old school spyderedge nation