School Me On Guided Sharpeners

[The Meat man]

I keep the same angle, but try to make the last few passes as light as I can possibly make them. Then I check the edge under a strong light and magnifying glass. If there is a burr, I make another 1 or 2 ultra light passes. I keep checking, going back and forth, until it looks like the burr is gone. Sometimes this takes awhile, chasing the burr back and forth from one side to another. :/

[TkoK83Spy]

I've got a 10x loupe with a light arriving tomorrow from Amazon. Hoping that will also aid me in these wars with burrs!

[brainfriction]

My favorite abrasive for this system is the Venev bonded diamond, it's an excellent compromise of cutting speed, slow wear and price, plus there are available grits from extremely coarse to 1 micron.

Same here, The bonded diamond stones are the best of both worlds, plus they cut through stuff like s30v, s110v, m4, etc with ease compared to ceramic or alum oxide. The metallic bonded cbn stones are nice too, although rather expensive they don't dish out nearly as fast.

[Danvp]

Rick, sharpening M390 with the sharpmaker and the brown rods is in my opinion a big challenge. I am not talking about touch ups but reprofiling.

I often still make the mistake to move forward to a finer grit. Just did that today with my chap and was punished for it. Did not see any light reflecting from the edge however when cutting paper it snagged into it. I moved on from medium to fine. My mistake. Could not get it sharp enough. So i had to go back to the brown rods again.

My point here is that for M390 you maybe need the diamond rods first. I have used them and they helped me get a good edge on my M390 and 20CV knives. It could possible save you a lot of time and you can still make light passes.

I am curious what your experience will be when using your incoming loupe. I own one but have not yet found the proper way to check my edges with it. Still have to learn that part.

More on topic: with the diamond rods you can also reprofile on the sharpmaker. When i do not feel like setting up my WE i just use the sharpmaker. Maybe not the best choice in every occasion, but it often works for me.

[Bloke]

Back at it on the Sharpmaker for me today. I believe patience and light strokes is starting to work. Lack of patience probably led to more pressure than required last night. Funny, I feel like I've always used the same pressure as last night and always achieved great results. I'll keep at it this way though.

For those of you that use a Sharpmaker, for your last few passes on the flats with the brown stones, do you typically increase the angle ever so slightly and make a few light passes or keep the same angle that got you there?

OK Rick, glad the SharpMaker isn’t in the bin! Ah, hahaha! :p
As you may imagine the finer the stone the less it cuts and the less pressure it requires to cut. To that end, when you have a nice clean apex, tip to heel and no burrs, Do Not hold the SharpMaker any more! Make sure it’s on a bench/surface that will allow if to move around easily. Now take your final alternating passes. If you’re SharpMaker moves at all, you’re using too much pressure.

As taught to me by brother Vivi. :cool:

[Tims]

Back at it on the Sharpmaker for me today. I believe patience and light strokes is starting to work. Lack of patience probably led to more pressure than required last night. Funny, I feel like I've always used the same pressure as last night and always achieved great results. I'll keep at it this way though.

For those of you that use a Sharpmaker, for your last few passes on the flats with the brown stones, do you typically increase the angle ever so slightly and make a few light passes or keep the same angle that got you there?

OK Rick, glad the SharpMaker isn’t in the bin! Ah, hahaha! :p
As you may imagine the finer the stone the less it cuts and the less pressure it requires to cut. To that end, when you have a nice clean apex, tip to heel and no burrs, Do Not hold the SharpMaker any more! Make sure it’s on a bench/surface that will allow if to move around easily. Now take your final alternating passes. If you’re SharpMaker moves at all, you’re using too much pressure.

As taught to me by brother Vivi. :cool:

Little tips like that are gold when you’re starting out

[BLUETYPEII]

What does everyone think about the Lansky guided sharpeners?

The price point is lower than the KME by quite a bit.

I’m very much in need of a quality sharpener so any constructive response would be great... thanks everyone!

[cbrstar]

What does everyone think about the Lansky guided sharpeners?

The price point is lower than the KME by quite a bit.

I’m very much in need of a quality sharpener so any constructive response would be great... thanks everyone!

If you buy one make sure that everything is 100% straight. When I bought mine I had one warped rod, and one warped stone. I couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong.
Also if you are looking for that mirror perfect edge spend the extra money on a deluxe one. I ended up replacing most of the stones with the diamond and ceramic ones. Which ended up costing more then the better kit lol

[BLUETYPEII]

What does everyone think about the Lansky guided sharpeners?

The price point is lower than the KME by quite a bit.

I’m very much in need of a quality sharpener so any constructive response would be great... thanks everyone!

If you buy one make sure that everything is 100% straight. When I bought mine I had one warped rod, and one warped stone. I couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong.
Also if you are looking for that mirror perfect edge spend the extra money on a deluxe one. I ended up replacing most of the stones with the diamond and ceramic ones. Which ended up costing more then the better kit lol

Thanks for the useful info I appreciate it.

[toxophilus]

What I want:
- An effective way to reprofile thick edges to give a consistent edge angle and clean, even bevels. This would be its main purpose.
- Adjustable angle, preferably no more than 15 DPS to set the main bevel (a little smaller would be a plus).
- Will probably end up using diamonds.
- The ability to use more than "store brand" stones would probably be a plus unless the stock stones are good, reasonably priced, and have a reasonable service life.
- I don't need superhigh grits. As it is I finish at 1200 grit at most.

Edge Pro, KME, Hapstone, Wicked edge, etc. - a dizzying array of expensive options.

Pro/con of the different systems?

I use the Sharpmaker, Edge Pro & the WE Field & Sport; you'll have a learning curve regardless of which system you use.

• Edge Pro; I really like that you can rest the ricasso/choil section of most Spydercos on the table of the Edge Pro it give me consistency even though most blades are distally tapered. I can still achieve symmetrical blade bevels and I have no trouble reaching that little j-hook area by the ricasso to sharpen the full blade edge
  
  You can obtain diamond plates (I use an Atoma140 diamond plate) to customize you're set up for re-profiling.
  
  If your interest is in obtaining a really low DPS the a small knife adapter can be added to it which raises the table thereby allowing you to lower the adjustment rod to attain low angles.
  
  The EP will be wet & messy, stones usually soak in water prior to sharpening and it's important to apply soap-water while sharpening to keep them from clogging up; you'll also need to periodically flatten your stones to keep from dishing out; except for the diamond stones
  
  Rather than using the sharpie method to locate the angle when changing out stones/plates I set up the drill stop collar to account for differing stone/plate thickness on the EP

• WE Field & Sport; I noticed that I would get uneven bevels if I don't apply the math formula to achieve vertical centering (this happens regardless of whichever generation clamps I'm using on my FFG Spydercos), I'm currently using the Gen 3 clamp but when measuring the flats of the blade when clamped there is enough blade lean to make a difference (my OCD :p ). I'll make the adjustments and when all is said & done, the bevels look even upon completion.
  
  Also with the WE, to reach the areas by the ricasso I've ground down the sides of the platens/paddles to get the stones as close as I can without marring the edge of the ricasso; I also like the diamond stones as they will take on any steel regardless of how easy/hard it might be to sharpen when using other sharpening systems.
  
  WE can get dusty, some folks use a wet sponge to press the stones onto to keep the dust from the steel down to minimum, it will take many knives to wear down the diamond stones; I usually flip mine around while sharpening to try & even out the wear (in my mind at least)

IMO an angle cube is important to verify the work you're doing on blades; depending on how far out you stick the blade from the edge of the table/jaws of the vise the angle will change.
It's also important to let the stones do the work (no unnecessary pressure)

On either system it's recommended that you tape up your blade to protect it and/or the action so that it doesn't become contaminated otherwise you may have to disassemble to clean out the innards.

• The Sharpmaker is mainly used to touch up our kitchen knives

If you do decide to go with an Edge Pro I would recommend getting the very basic model and then adding the stones/plates that YOU want for it; I initially bought an Apex 4 and eventually bought Shapton/Diamond plates for my set up; I bought a Congress 400 & 800 grit stones but haven't set them up yet as the WE has taken over..

Feel free to PM me if you have further questions, thx, Fugi

[cbrstar]

What does everyone think about the Lansky guided sharpeners?

The price point is lower than the KME by quite a bit.

I’m very much in need of a quality sharpener so any constructive response would be great... thanks everyone!

If you buy one make sure that everything is 100% straight. When I bought mine I had one warped rod, and one warped stone. I couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong.
Also if you are looking for that mirror perfect edge spend the extra money on a deluxe one. I ended up replacing most of the stones with the diamond and ceramic ones. Which ended up costing more then the better kit lol

Thanks for the useful info I appreciate it.

NP I have both the lansky and the sharp maker and there are advantages to both.

I use the Lansky when I have a old knife with no edge or a chipped blade. You can quickly re-profile a blade with it.

But it has a couple of short comings. 1) Can't sharpen small knives like a SAK. 2) The angle is inconsistent depending on how deep you place it on the blade. 3) Can't really use it for fast touch ups or honing. (See the above reason for why)

The sharp maker is great for touch ups but can be tedious for re-profiling. At least in my experience.

[TkoK83Spy]

I posted this part below in another thread, but since the Sharpmaker has been talked about a lot here, I figured I'd attach it here as well...

So I received my 10X led lighted loupe yesterday. As good as advertised and well worth the $8. Thing nearly blinded me about 10 times reflecting off the blades last night haha.

Turns out the 4 knives I'm struggling with, the burr is on the show side of each blade and part of the apex. I went to work on the Centofante last night, figuring VG10 would be easiest of the steels I need to work at. I couldn't take it off with a few swipes at that diamond rod I posted above, the corners of the brown rods or flats of the browns. I tried light and at times light/medium pressure on all 3 setups and just couldn't get it with a little more than an hour of time invested! It looks a little smaller than when I began, but it never flipped to the other side of the blade or to only the apex. Left defeated, I gave it a rest of the night and will get back to it after work today.

Any ideas what I could be doing wrong here? I've done heel to tip, tip to heel, scrubbing motion using both, Increased and decreased my angle ever so slightly. I'm going to get this figured out one way or another, just feeling a bit defeated that maybe I had beginners luck for that first 8 months or so and now it's starting to wear off.

Does this sound like something where I should invest in the diamond rods for the Sharpmaker, to make this task easier??

[Zatx]

I posted this part below in another thread, but since the Sharpmaker has been talked about a lot here, I figured I'd attach it here as well...

So I received my 10X led lighted loupe yesterday. As good as advertised and well worth the $8. Thing nearly blinded me about 10 times reflecting off the blades last night haha.

Turns out the 4 knives I'm struggling with, the burr is on the show side of each blade and part of the apex. I went to work on the Centofante last night, figuring VG10 would be easiest of the steels I need to work at. I couldn't take it off with a few swipes at that diamond rod I posted above, the corners of the brown rods or flats of the browns. I tried light and at times light/medium pressure on all 3 setups and just couldn't get it with a little more than an hour of time invested! It looks a little smaller than when I began, but it never flipped to the other side of the blade or to only the apex. Left defeated, I gave it a rest of the night and will get back to it after work today.

Any ideas what I could be doing wrong here? I've done heel to tip, tip to heel, scrubbing motion using both, Increased and decreased my angle ever so slightly. I'm going to get this figured out one way or another, just feeling a bit defeated that maybe I had beginners luck for that first 8 months or so and now it's starting to wear off.

Does this sound like something where I should invest in the diamond rods for the Sharpmaker, to make this task easier??

I missed this reply in the other thread and can't find it so I'll post my solution for your problem here until I find it.

I believe in that other thread I posted a book on removing the burr that was written by a gentleman who used rigorous scientific research and an electron scanning microscope to determine what works best to remove a burr (http://knifegrinders.com.au/Manuals/Kni ... g_book.pdf). His findings indicated that the only way to remove a burr from modern super-steels is using a low-speed grinder, hard felt disk, and .5 micron diamond powder.

The main thing he proved is that diamond is the only thing hard enough to remove the microscopic foil or wire type burr. Leather doesn't do it; green strops don't do it, ceramic stones can't do it; they simply aren't sharp/hard enough. What stropping does with these lesser media is hone the steel surrounding the harder carbides in the matrix, leaving the burr behind. Oh, yes, you will undoubtedly get very sharp blades using these other techniques, but an edge with zero burr will be sharper and last much much longer than one with even a microscopic burr.

Well, I don't have the grinder or felt pad, so I adapted his technique utilizing the tools I have available. Using a piece of the hardest balsa wood I could find I made a strop utilizing a mixture of .5 and 1.0-micron diamond paste. I uniformly spread the paste on the wood then used a heat gun to dry the oil from the compound. So, what I do is take a freshly sharpened knife and examine the burr under a 120x microscope. No matter how much care I take to keep this burr as small as possible while sharpening, there is always one present if I'm hitting the apex at all. I then strop the knife once or twice using light to medium pressure at the same angle of sharpening on the side that has the least burr and examine it again under the microscope. If the light drops entirely off of the edge, the burr is gone (at least to the level I can see at this magnification). I then switch sides and strop a couple of times then inspect and repeat this process until the burr is gone. Flip the knife one more time to make sure I didn't create a burr on the opposite side and then stop. If you overstrop, you'll round the apex and slightly dull the edge, though at this microscopic level you probably won't be able to notice this by feel.

I've now used two very different sharpening systems (Sharpmaker and Ken Onion Blade Grinder) to reprofile and sharpen identical PM2's. The Sharpmaker creates a very flat bevel, and the Ken Onion makes the bevel more convex, but this technique produced similar results... an extraordinarily sharp and durable edge that was burr free at least at 120x magnification.

Understand, that my technique will not produce an edge that is quite as durable as the grinder/felt pad technique because the research showed that there was some work hardening that occurred by the speed and vibration of the felt pad, but the edge will still be more durable than an edge with a burr.