Fist in the Eye

[supracor]

I have always had a relationship of love and hate with Spyderco products; leaving the different models that don't attract me at all there are an enormous number of designs that are wonderful, ergonomic, innovative and very functional.
However (and here i explain the relationship of love and hate) there is always in these designs that particular irreconcilable that creates conflicting ideas in my head and ends with a spiritual struggle.

For example, I've loved Spyderco Puukko since I've seen it: leather sheath, desert ironwood handle, zero-ground 0.2 "blade, a dream that comes true.

Then I go to see the steel and close my eyes in horror.

This is just one of the most striking examples.


Why does all this happen?

[vivi]

I thought I remembered that being O1, turns out it was S30V. Strange choice for a puuko.

[awa54]

The sad truth is that traditional designs like the Pukko are usually worked out over generations and evolve around available materials and regional preferences, when you "update" that basic form without carefully studying its original context there is usually something lost in translation...

[tvenuto]

Maybe Spyderco thought an S30V pukko was better than no pukko at all? I think us in forum land don’t fully appreciate the myriad factors involved in bringing a knife to market. There are considerations and compromises that we aren’t aware of, and I think of this every time the forum asks something like: “why was X knife not made in Y country?” Etc.

I’m not in any better position to know those factors, I’m just aware that I don’t know them. Im not saying to stop asking why decisions were made, just don’t assume it wasn’t a well considered decision even if you don’t agree.

For instance, I want to see more AEB-L, and think it would have been a good choice here. However, I’m in the minority and Spyderco sells to a larger audience, so I don’t assume they’re dumb for not putting AEB-L on models where I (personally) think it would be a better choice (performance-wise, if not sales-wise).

[vivi]

I would think that 1095, O1, A2 etc. would be cheaper, and more suitable for a fixed blade with a very thin edge, but I'm just a guy that uses puukos here and there for fun. Sal obviously knows more about these things than I could ever dream of knowing.

[brainfriction]

I believe Puukkos are traditionally made with a very high hardness, high carbon steel right? Out of the available steels which would have been the best fit in your mind?

[vivi]

I believe Puukkos are traditionally made with a very high hardness, high carbon steel right? Out of the available steels which would have been the best fit in your mind?

I had custom puukos in O1 that took an incredibly edge and worked great at the low angle scandis are ground at. I believe Spyderco themselves used that on the Bushcrafter...which is what I confused the Puuko with when it comes to blade steel...

[knivesandbooks]

S30v may have been the compromise to get people to buy it. A lot of people are afraid of high carbon and a lot of non-afi types want to see the words "powder metallurgy" or "super steel".

I'd still buy it in s30v if I was in the market for a puukko.
That said, I'd prefer O1, A2, 3v, or 4v.

[SG89]

Maybe s30v kept the cost down since desert ironwood probably increased the price to begin with?

[TomAiello]

While I have grown to love non-stainless steels (Maxamet and K390 will do that to you), I think that the market tends to like stainless.

The average knife purchaser just isn't going to take care of things, and that stainless will give a much better impression over the long run. Given that, using a stainless in the Puuko, while not traditional at all (and not my choice for this style of knife) does make commercial sense. Look at the fact that Benchmade used s30v in their bushcrafter (another really non-sensical choice from the perspective of an "afi") and you can probably see how the market is driving things.

That said, I think that a Puuko sprint in something like O-1 (or K390!) would be amazing. :)

[supracor]

I ask because i can't understand why at Golden they have decided so :confused:

Spyderco has used 52100, O1 and BD1; these are all better choices for a zero ground knife used mainly for woodcarving.

5160, 1095, Aeb-L, A8, W1, 12c27, A2, and similia are the best choice, but there are also more wear resistant steels like M2 or 3V that can be good; in fact there are an enormous number of steels that are better than S30V for the tasks that a Puukko has to do.

3V is highly praised on the market. A 3V Puukko would sell surely better than a S30V one.

[SF Native]

It’s a collaboration knife. Maybe the designer had some input.
Have any of you tried this knife?
I have one and it’s the sharpest most blood thirsty blade I have. With a zero grind, it’s so thin it cut me badly by just rolling over in my hand. Not sure if they changed the heat treat for added toughness but I have beat this blade pretty hard and had no issues with chipping.
What is your complaint with s30v?
You want more traditional? But a mora.

[TomAiello]

There are lots of good Puukos in the market with carbon steels. I own a couple--my favorite is the Roselli.

I think that these Spyderco offerings tend to be a little more of a "modern take on a traditional knife".

All good--just different. If I wanted a true Puuko, I wouldn't choose the Spyderco version. I'd choose the Spyderco version for itself.

[Daveho]

S30v is a fine all round steel and given the intended use of the knife it’s a fine choice.

[gundamaniac]

Perhaps they optimized the heat treat for toughness in the puuko. We can speculate all we like, but we need more real world feedback for this model. It certainly looks beautiful, and I agree that it's interesting they chose S30V for this model. It's Spyderco though, so I'm sure they carefully considered the balance of necessary properties for this knife when they chose the steel.

[sal]

Hi Supracor,

We opted for a stainless to bring the design into a broader realm. It was our first Puuko and out first collaboration with the maker. We also made the knife quite a while ago before we were using as many steels as we are now. Hard to please everyone.

sal

[Halfneck]

I love Pekka's puukos and was glad to see Spyderco doing a collaboration with him. I'd hoped that it would be O1 like the Bushcraft. I was a bit disappointed when S30V was announced. S30V is not among my favorite steels, and with it's chippy reputation seemed an odd choice for a Scandi-edge. That combined with the price kept me from getting one.

[Sharp Guy]

...Hard to please everyone.

sal

I'm sure you know this too well! :D

[brainfriction]

with it's chippy reputation seemed an odd choice for a Scandi-edge. That combined with the price kept me from getting one.

That's a fair point, but I always thought it was the quality of the heat treat that determined whether s30v was chippy or not. Afaik, Spyderco has that process down pretty well.

[sal]

We've not had a chipping problem with S30V. It's been a very reliable steel for us.

sal