Can we Spyderco users be assured VG10 will be with us for a good long time?

[SpyderEdgeForever]

I have heard some complaints by some who have purchased and used Spyderco knives about VG10 being a "sub optimal steel". I have some questions about this, considering there were recent threads on here rightfully showing that VG10 is a great steel.

1 Why do you think some have made such complaints and given bad feedback about VG10? One claim is there are better forms of steel that hold better edges and such. But experienced knife users on here seem to appreciate VG10.

2 What is the closest steel you know of that is like VG10 but has a different chemical makeup?

3 Can we be assured that as far as the foreseeable future goes, Spyderco will continue to make knives with VG10 blades?

[fanglekai]

People complain because other steels have a higher number in their name. I don't see any reason to replace VG-10.

[zhyla]

I’m sure at some point some other steel will make sense. We’re only getting VG-10 out of Seki right? It’s time may come.

[JD Spydo]

One thing that really makes me keep a lot of my VG-10 Spyders is that it is a very dependable blade steel and I've had great overall luck with using it over the years. I just sharpened my plain edge TEMPERANCE 1 model this evening and yes it has VG-10 steel. It sliced through cigarette rolling paper like a laser. Actually it did about as good as my M390 Military did. Hey you couldn't ask for more than that from a knife that I mainly use in the kitchen lately.

Also VG-10 has the distinction of working just as good in Spyderedge as it does in plain edge. There are not that many steels I've found to work that well in both edge types. Yes I will be using some of my VG-10 models for years to come I'm sure of it. I still hear people raving about the TEMPERANCE 2 model which also has VG-10 blade steel in spite of the fact that Spyderco has provided us with fixed blades that have supersteels>> but some stay with VG-10 and that should tell us all something. I've always liked it better than S30V and a few others I could mention. It will be with us for a while I can assure you of that :cool:

[Tucson Tom]

I only have VG-10 in my Temperance-2 and my Street Bowie. Both very unique fixed blades. I think it is a fine steel, but maybe it is getting long in the tooth? Now that my sharpening skills are improving my views toward S30V are changing significantly. It is a darn good steel. People say that VG-10 sharpens like a dream, but I haven't personally investigated as yet. I am still a fan of 154CM and a lot of folks seem to have decided it should be laid to rest. But for folders, I am all about these crazy exotic new steels. Gimme M4 or 52100 or CTS-204p.

You know what might be interesting is a fixed blade in 52100. Like a Temperance-2 in 52100. Hmmm.

[knivesandbooks]

Spyderco better keep vg10 and S30v around, unless they want to replace vg10 with hap40 or s30v with xhp. I like to have steels around that are easy to maintain. Bd1 is good too but not as good as vg10 or S30v. I like the edges I can get on them and I like how easy I can bring them back to life. They can get very sharp, stay sharp, and in a short amount of time be renewed. I'm all about that. That's part of the reason why I chose the vtoku2 sprint as well and why I like cru wear. High enough performance, well balanced, and manageable.

[Humint]

I don't mind VG10 but honestly I would rather see all VG10 knives be swapped over for s30v. I think s30v is the best "all around" steel out there. My favorite steel though is CTS-XHP (imo a step up over s30v) but I don't see Spyderco swapping out VG10 for CTS-XHP, I could see them switching over from VG10 to s30v.

[ABX2011]

They aren't going to switch VG-10 to S30V across the board. Shipping steel to Japan for the FRN models raises the price in budget models that are very price sensitive.
Sal has said VG-10 is tough to beat in terms of performance/price.
Personally I don't like VG-10. It's very burr prone. Seems to respond well to stropping but I like a coarser edge.

[TomAiello]

I like VG-10 in knives I sharpen often. It's not my favorite for an occasionally sharpened knife that I want to hold an edge a long time (which is my normal EDC pattern). For something like a kitchen knife, where I want a sharp edge and can sharpen frequently, I think it's great.

I wonder what would happen if they renamed it VG-1000?

[NickShabazz]

VG-10 is a nice mix of edge-holding, easy sharpenability, and cost, and has a great future as a budget-friendly or beginner-friendly steel. In a budget folder, it's a stellar choice, and I really hope that VG-10 starts to take on the kind of role currently occupied by 8Cr13MoV and AUS-8: a solid choice for budget-focused pieces, but seldom found above $50 or so.

That said, given the excellence of the many mid-price steel options out there (S30V, S35VN, XHP) in terms of wear resistance, I really balk when I see VG-10 above a $70 price point. Particularly in the Japanese G10 knives (e.g. the Parata, Ouroboros, Q Ball) for $150+, that's just one of those things that turns me off. It's fine, it'll work, but once we start hitting those price ranges, I'd rather have something which I'll be sharpening a bit less often, and it starts to feel like a cut corner. I know this is preference, but given the choice of something like S30V, ZDP, HAP-40, or XHP vs. VG-10, the choice is easy (and VG-10 isn't winning).

So, I hope VG-10 sticks around in the budget world, and it'd be a great upgrade for the Tenaciouses and Byrds of the world (pretending of course that Japanese steels made sense in Chinese knives), but I sure wouldn't mind seeing it retired in mid-range to higher-end pieces in favor of some of the excellent compositions that have followed it.

[Mattysc42]

I’d like it if vg 10 were replaced by lc200n. Then again, I’d like to see every knife with lc200n as an option.

[knivesandbooks]

I want to know if we will see anything else in the vg10 Damascus. I quite like it.

[sal]

Hi MAttysc,

Welcome to our forum.

LC200N is not likely to replace VG-10. And we'll likely to continue using VG-10 unless something better comes along in Japan.

sal

[Sjucaveman]

VG-11 incoming

[Tucson Tom]

I have to speculate that a lot of this depends on the situation in Japan as much as pros and cons of various steels. I could be wrong, but aren't all of the Seki City Spydercos done with Japanese Steels? It just might be that VG10 is the "bang for the buck" steel to be used in the Japanese knives. It ain't no slouch either. LC200N is a german steel, and Sal has already said that ain't happenin'. I suspect that issues with Japanese culture as much as technology and economics come into play. I would also be very surprised if Japanese steels ended up in the Chinese knives and could imagine issues arising at either end of that exchange. But what do I know?

Hap40 and zdp-189 would seem to be the upgrade paths with current Japanese steels. I would be really surprised if any non-stainless steels were used for regular production knives. That would rule out Hap40, and from what I hear zdp189 is fairly corrosion prone for a stainless steel, so I can see reasons for sticking with vg10 in Japanese production. But this is all armchair speculation.

[abbazaba]

I have to speculate that a lot of this depends on the situation in Japan as much as pros and cons of various steels. I could be wrong, but aren't all of the Seki City Spydercos done with Japanese Steels?

Recently Seki has used S30v (Delica) and K390 (Police). I thought Sal mentioned not long ago that it was something they were going to try more of?

[Woodpuppy]

Time will tell, I only now have some VG10 to try out. I can say I was thoroughly dismayed at the prevalence of s30v as the base steel for US made spydercos. While I have not tried it in a Spyderco, I have in two other brands and I can say I won’t buy it again.

I don’t like to spend a lot of time and effort sharpening. Polished edges look cool but that takes a commitment to maintain. I want to be able to quickly touch up a tool and go about my business. This means that for me super stainless steels are just out (except for H1 & LC200n).

I haven’t needed to sharpen my 52100, M4 or hap40 knives yet, but I’ve had them for less than two months.

Some folks are steel junkies and Spyderco provides. Some folks work in extreme environments and have specific needs, and Spyderco provides. Some folks have simple needs and Spyderco provides. No need to pitch something from the lineup that still sells. Spyderco provides. Please be seated.

[sal]

Hi Tom,

LC will be used in Seki made Salt series models, but it is not likely to replace VG-10. We can use other steels with one maker in Seki, but they are more expensive due to steel costs and shipping.

sal

[Tucson Tom]

Time will tell, I only now have some VG10 to try out. I can say I was thoroughly dismayed at the prevalence of s30v as the base steel for US made spydercos. While I have not tried it in a Spyderco, I have in two other brands and I can say I won’t buy it again.

As for S30V, I come from exactly where you say you are. I had some poorly sharpened blades from another maker that made me think it was crap and I wondered what all the fuss was about. Then I just had to get a backlock Manix, and it is only available in S30V. That knife came really sharp and began to change my opinion. Then I began to improve my sharpening skills. A few seconds on the Goldenstone and I had my oldest PM2 (the original S30V) scary sharp and I started to really rethink S30V. Someday I am going to reprofile those "other maker" knives and see if I can put a respectable edge on them. I suspect I will be able to. But no bad words from me about what Spyderco does with S30V.

[sal]

Hi Woodpuppy,

Not all knife manufactures are created equal.

sal