Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: folder with two locks on it?

  1. #1
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Strong-Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    521

    folder with two locks on it?

    With "hard use"being all the craze lately, I'm wondering why no one (to my knowledge) has built a knife with two different locking-mechanisms on it. It would take some mechanical refining, but I'm thinking two locks that wouldn't interfere with each other like a compression lock and a liner lock. That way, either way force is put into the knife you're good to go. Now, I'm not a believer in the "hard-use" fad, but I do think something like this would be interesting. A frame-lock and an axis-lock? Maybe two compression locks on each side of the blade and a mechanism that rolls or slides down the center of the liners towards the blade to unlock both of the compression locks at the same time. Wait, that's actually a good idea....is it? Maybe I'll draw a diagram a post it.
    Q: What was the most positive result of the "Cash for clunkers"
    program?

    A: It took 95% of the Obama bumper stickers off the road.
    -Letterman

  2. #2
    Spyderco Forum Registered User ASmitty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    South Dakota
    Posts
    859
    Quote Originally Posted by Strong-Dog View Post
    With "hard use"being all the craze lately, I'm wondering why no one (to my knowledge) has built a knife with two different locking-mechanisms on it. It would take some mechanical refining, but I'm thinking two locks that wouldn't interfere with each other like a compression lock and a liner lock. That way, either way force is put into the knife you're good to go. Now, I'm not a believer in the "hard-use" fad, but I do think something like this would be interesting. A frame-lock and an axis-lock? Maybe two compression locks on each side of the blade and a mechanism that rolls or slides down the center of the liners towards the blade to unlock both of the compression locks at the same time. Wait, that's actually a good idea....is it? Maybe I'll draw a diagram a post it.
    I think the greatest difficulty with something like this would be trying to release both locks at the same time.

    Many knives have employed something similar to this with secondary locks that keep the lock from disengaging. Almost all auto knives employ something like this, and CRKT has the LAWKS system they use on some of their products as well.
    "A flute with no holes is not a flute. A donut with no hole, is a danish."

  3. #3
    Spyderco Forum Registered User yablanowitz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Liberal, Kansas
    Posts
    4,271
    Two locks? Stick to fixed blades. As far as I'm concerned, the "hard use" fad is really the " brute force and ignorance should equal skill" fad.
    I don't believe in safe queens, only in pre-need replacements.

  4. #4
    Spyderco Forum Registered User phillipsted's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    North Virginia
    Posts
    3,347
    For me, Hard Use = Fixed Blade.

    Right tool for the job.

    TedP

  5. #5
    Spyderco Forum Registered User The Deacon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Upstate SC, USA
    Posts
    21,261
    If by two locks, you mean a secondary lock to prevent accidental disengagement of the primary lock, it has been done. Extrema Ratio, for one, produces them. I agree with Ted though and for anything where the question of whether or not a midlock would be strong enough even entered my mind, I'll opt for a fixed blade.
    Paul
    My Personal Website ---- Beginners Guide to Spyderco Collecting ---- Kiwimania ---- Spydiewiki
    Dead horses beaten, sacred cows tipped, chimeras hunted when time permits.
    WTC # 1458 - 1504 - 1508 - Never Forget, Never Forgive!

  6. #6
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Evil D's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Northern KY
    Posts
    9,156
    Sure there are. Let me introduce you to the Wildsteer WX. It has a ridiculous lock system that literally cannot be unlocked unless you intentionally do it. Lets see if I can explain all this...first there's 2 springs along the top of the spine. The top one on the outside that you see is the primary lock that has a square hole cutout that snaps over a hook/notch on the tang and is the primary lock. When this lock engages, there is an additional lock that snaps over top of a tab sticking out off the side of that spring, preventing it from being pressed up and being unlocked unless you pull the trigger. Underneath the primary back spring lock is an additional back spring that engages a notch on the tang that essentially acts as a sort of slip joint, but it's extremely strong and takes both hands to snap into place. Lastly there's an additional trigger that spins in place, physically preventing the primary lock trigger from being disengaged. It all sounds super complicated, but it really isn't. To open/lock the knife you just pull it open, which takes both hands. Once the blade snaps into place, it's locked. All you do is spin the lock safety into place and the knife is now locked and will not come unlocked no matter what. To unlock, you just turn the safety and pull the trigger, and push the blade closed (again taking two hands).

    Is this better than a fixed blade? In some ways yes, as it can be folded and put in your pocket. Is it something you'd EDC, lol no. Is it as strong as a fixed blade? IMO yes in every way except in extreme lateral stress, in which case I bet you would break a fixed blade not long after you break this knife. The lock is indestructible. You will no doubt break the blade either at the tang or elsewhere before the lock fails, so in that regard this knife does completely eliminate lock failure. The only thing left as a weak link is the pivot, which is in the neighborhood of 3/16 or so, combined with a 1/4 inch thick blade, so the pivot is about as strong as any pivot you're going to find on a folder. I'm sure there are fixed blades that are stronger, but as far as folders go I don't think you'll find a stronger one, not a RAO, not a Strider.

    For me, a large part of my love of folders is the engineering that goes into the pivot and lock, so whether or not this is or isn't better than a fixed blade is irrelevant to me, because it's just plain old fun and a masterpiece of over built awesomeness.









    SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
    ~David

    Official plea to Sal: Can we PLEASE get a DLC Yojimbo 2? PLEASE!!?

  7. #7
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Strong-Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    521
    Evil....wow. While somewhat impractical, that's pretty cool.
    Q: What was the most positive result of the "Cash for clunkers"
    program?

    A: It took 95% of the Obama bumper stickers off the road.
    -Letterman

  8. #8
    Spyderco Forum Registered User paladin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Hotel Carlton-San Francisco
    Posts
    529
    Spyderco's auto knifes, essentially, have 2 safeties.
    Have Kiwi, will travel...wire Paladin...Hotel Carlton, San Francisco

  9. #9
    Spyderco Forum Registered User 3rdGenRigger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Calgary Alberta Canada
    Posts
    859
    I thought the LionSpy (Collaboration with LionSteel) had a secondary lock on the side that you could engage to prevent the frame lock from being able to be accidentally opened.
    Ladybug (Salt/SuperBlue/White SE), Native (FRN), Dragonfly (Salt/Orange/SuperBlue/G10), Lava (Blue), Ulize, Byrdwrench
    Para-Military 2 (Digi-Cam/Green), Jester (Grey), Caly3/3.5 (CF), Domino (Blue), Stretch (SuperBlue), Spyderwrench
    Schempp Tuff, Goddard OD, Mule (K390), Manix2 LW (BD1), Sage 3 (CF), Vallotton, Techno
    2013 Forum Native, Delica 4 (Damascus), Chokwe, Swick 3, Battlestation, Military (CruWear)

    -> Branden

  10. #10
    Spyderco Forum Registered User paladin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Hotel Carlton-San Francisco
    Posts
    529
    Quote Originally Posted by 3rdGenRigger View Post
    I thought the LionSpy (Collaboration with LionSteel) had a secondary lock on the side that you could engage to prevent the frame lock from being able to be accidentally opened.
    yup, that's the Roto-Lok
    Have Kiwi, will travel...wire Paladin...Hotel Carlton, San Francisco

  11. #11
    Spyderco Forum Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    36280
    Posts
    712
    The CRKT Kit Carson with aotu LAWKS is exactly what you described and one of the only knives I would recommend to take into harms way as far as lock backs go. The last time I was in a war zone the back lock broke on the folded I was carrying and that's why I highly recommend the Kit Carson M16 series. They are rugged and very economical

  12. #12
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Jazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    3,719
    Extrema Ratio has lockbacks with a little tab that slides over to prevent pressing the lock bar. I wish Spyderco would use it on something.
    - best wishes, Jazz.

  13. #13
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Strong-Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    521
    I'm not talking about a lock and them a safety mechanism to prevent that lock from disengaging, I'm talking about two bonafide locks that both hold the knife open in different ways
    Q: What was the most positive result of the "Cash for clunkers"
    program?

    A: It took 95% of the Obama bumper stickers off the road.
    -Letterman

  14. #14
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Evil D's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Northern KY
    Posts
    9,156
    It might be possible to create a knife with a CBBL and back lock. I'm not sure how smooth the back lock bar would be riding over the CBBL notch when opening it, and it would be real interesting to figure out how to unlock but it's probably possible.

    SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
    ~David

    Official plea to Sal: Can we PLEASE get a DLC Yojimbo 2? PLEASE!!?

  15. #15
    Spyderco Forum Registered User xceptnl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Moonshine Country, Virginia
    Posts
    5,393
    Quote Originally Posted by Evil D View Post
    It might be possible to create a knife with a CBBL and back lock. I'm not sure how smooth the back lock bar would be riding over the CBBL notch when opening it, and it would be real interesting to figure out how to unlock but it's probably possible.
    This was my thought. With a dedicated secondary lock, your would have a second detent with a secondary amount of force and friction resisting the opening action. It could feel like an old Buck 110 and take 2 hands to open.
    My 's:
    Native, Manix 2 (BD1,154CM,S30V,M4,XHP,S110V,Cruwear), Delica 4 (White,Red,Brown,Blue,BRG,G-10), Spyderhawk, D'fly (H1,G-10,SB), Police3, Volpe, Military (S30V,XHP,D2,M390,BG42,440V,Cruwear), Superleafs, Forager, D2 Para, Kopas, Kiwis, Caly (JR's,3,3.5), Para2 (XHP,204P), Stretch (SS,FRN's,CF), Rescues, Dyad Jr, Pingos, Southard, AIR, Jess Horns, Forum N5, Lil Matriarch, Barong, Superhawk, Chinook II, ATR, SPY-DK, Captain, Ti UKPK, Mules

    *Landon*

  16. #16
    Spyderco Forum Registered User bh49's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    former Constitution state
    Posts
    8,322

    C50

    Quote Originally Posted by Strong-Dog View Post
    I'm wondering why no one (to my knowledge) has built a knife with two different locking-mechanisms on it.
    I briefly owned C50. The knife had two locks: liner lock and Slide SecurLok, designed by Frank Centofante. I wouldn't call this lock hard use though.
    "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf"
    George Orwell
    Any knife without Spyderhole is defective.
    My top choices Native5, G10/VG10 Caly 3.5/3 & C83 Persian Black micarta/bolsters

  17. #17
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Evil D's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Northern KY
    Posts
    9,156
    The problem is it would need to have the CBBL rather low on the handle to allow room for the back lock bar to be overtop of it. I think it's possible but probably needless too unless the rest of the knife is super over built like the Wildsteer is.

    SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
    ~David

    Official plea to Sal: Can we PLEASE get a DLC Yojimbo 2? PLEASE!!?

  18. #18
    Spyderco Forum Registered User The Deacon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Upstate SC, USA
    Posts
    21,261
    Quote Originally Posted by Strong-Dog View Post
    I'm not talking about a lock and them a safety mechanism to prevent that lock from disengaging, I'm talking about two bonafide locks that both hold the knife open in different ways
    While I realize it's not something that's important to everyone, you'd pretty much give up any chance of one hand closing since both would need to be disengaged simultaneously.
    Paul
    My Personal Website ---- Beginners Guide to Spyderco Collecting ---- Kiwimania ---- Spydiewiki
    Dead horses beaten, sacred cows tipped, chimeras hunted when time permits.
    WTC # 1458 - 1504 - 1508 - Never Forget, Never Forgive!

  19. #19
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Clip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Forest, VA
    Posts
    1,546
    You could put a left and right hand Military together, grid the lock face accordingly and have a double liner lock. Neither lock would ever travel over 50%!

    I'd stick with fixed blades personally.
    Click here to zoom: Under the Microscope

    Manix2, Elmax MT13, M4 Manix2, ZDP Caly3, ZDP Caly Jr, SB Caly3.5, M390 Para2, Cruwear MT12, Techno, XHP MT16, South Fork, SB Caly3, Manix2 Ltwt, Salt I, 20CP Para2, Military Left Hand, Perrin PPT, Forum Native5, Squeak, Manix 83mm, 440V Military, Gayle Bradley, Swick3, Lil' Temperance, Cruwear Military, VG10 Jester, Terzuola SlipIt, XHP Native Ltwt, Domino, CPM154/S90V Para2, SB Stretch, D2 Para, Dfly2 Salt, Tasman Salt

    Chris

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •