Manix 2 reassembly

[kbuzbee]

So..... I was thinking, my M4 Manix needed a good clean and lube (you know where this is going, right..?)

Came apart easily. Everything cleaned and nice application of Nano Oil I put the spring and backspacer back on, attached the pivot and washer, reinstalled the blade, second washer, slid the second scale back into place and replaced the pivot screw and remaining two scale screws

Everything seemed to be fine but after assembly there is some side to side blade play.... When closed, the blade moves almost from one scale to the other. 1/2 open the blade feels loose on the pivot. Open, it's not bad if the lock is engaged but if I pull it back you can feel the wobble.

What did I do wrong?

Ken

[DeathBySnooSnoo]

Mine was similar when I took it apart. I found that it took some fiddling around to get the screws tightened properly in proportion to each other to get the play gone, especially the first set of backspacer screws, but both sets need to be balanced. I found that cranking them down is too tight. Snug seems to be better for the back ones at least.
Also, make sure that the liners are square. With everything loose to the point of falling apart, I like to put it pivot end down, give it a good thump on a solid and flat surface and then while pressing down securely on the other end, start tightening the backspacer screws first, then the pivot.

Seemed to help mine, hopefully it will help yours.

[kbuzbee]

Thanks Graeme,

Tried it. Maybe helped a bit but it's still pretty loose. It's functional. I'm not going to really worry about it. Just wondered if I'd missed something obvious (I do that)

Thanks brother,

Ken

[cesar]

Maybe the ball of the lock? Look carefully IF it is there yet. The plastic support of the ball have a right side to place it in order to keep the ball locked inside. If you put the support inverted, the ball may run away without advice after 1st opening.

If you are still in troubles, please advise me in order to help you.

Cesar

[kbuzbee]

Hi Cesar,

Yes, the ball is present. I understand the cage needs to face the back spacer to contain the ball, and it is. Any other thoughts?

It's weird. It's like the pivot screws can't force the liners down tightly enough onto the washers, but they"feel" tight....

Ken

[mattman]

never disassembled one, so this is just a thought, but are the "shoulders" on the pivot bushing fully seated into the liner recesses?

don't know if that is easy to miss, or not...?

[kbuzbee]

never disassembled one, so this is just a thought, but are the "shoulders" on the pivot bushing fully seated into the liner recesses?

don't know if that is easy to miss, or not...?

Yeah, I thought about that and it could be what's going on. The first one is easy to see when you're reassembling. You put the washer down and feed the pivot through it into the liner and insert the screw. No worries. But on the other side you are sliding the liner/scale over it into position (because they are still attached by the lanyard hole) so it's a bit blind. I assume that was what Graeme was going for with his "tap it" suggestion. To ensure the pivot is fully seated. I've done it 4-5 times now, always with about the same result (switching "first" sides in case one side was seating more easily that the other). I don't know how to look "inside" to check it though.

Ken

[mattman]

Hmmm...

I have some more thoughts, but, as I have never disassembled one, I feel I would be sending you on a wild-goose chase...

Remove pivot screws, pinch scales at pivot location with fingers, and jiggle the blade slightly to "seat" the pivot bushing?

[kbuzbee]

Remove pivot screws, pinch scales at pivot location with fingers, and jiggle the blade slightly to "seat" the pivot bushing?

Not a wild goose chase at all. At this point any input is most welcome.

What you describe is pretty much how it goes back together. With the one side fully seated (which is easy to see) you position the other side until it kinda of snaps into place. It does, as Graeme mentioned, take a bit of "fiddling" but eventually it drops in. I have tried loosening the pivot screws after assembly, but nothing shifts further at that point.

Ken

[mattman]

well, the only other thing I can think of is washer mis-alignment?

Other than that, I'm going to sit back, and wait for those with more experience to chime in...

Please keep us updated! Good luck...

[cesar]

I have disassembled mine one time to clean and oil, and start a thread about fixed lanyard hole. Hummm, lets think what may happen... The scales look rock solid or are also wobble too? Did you tried to move it inside/outside and there is movement or not? The lanyard hole have larger corners than the body... are you sure that it is very well fixed to the right place (it is also over the g10 scales too)? If not, the space in scales can be justified by this concern, and obviously the blade move. I didn't removed the lanyard hole and let liners and scales together to clean. Try to double check it and return to us to tell how you are doing. Sure someone here will help and I will keep in touch.

[kbuzbee]

well, the only other thing I can think of is washer mis-alignment?

Can't see that. The pivot is cut to accept the washers on it's ends. If they are misaligned it won't go back together at all (which is kinda why you have to reassemble it in the order I described.

The scales look rock solid or are also wobble too?

The scales are solid and there does not appear to be any space between the scales/liner/back spacer.

Did you tried to move it inside/outside and there is movement or not?

There is slight movement at the tang (side to side), as if the pivot is too long (but it isn't). It almost has to be something is preventing the pivot from seating all the way (or preventing the pivot screws from tightening further) but I can't seem to get them any deeper. Regardless of which side I start with, that side appears flush (pivot to washer to liner) The gap has to be coming from the second side not seating correctly (just logicing through it)

The lanyard hole have larger corners than the body...

I didn't remove the lanyard hole either. It appears intact/in position with no space showing on the near post....

Ken

[jackknifeh]

When you put the first pivot screw in to hole the post in place snug it up but don't tighten. Put all the screws in on that side of the knife but don't tighten, just snug. When it is all together try tightening the pivot screws first. Since there are two I snug one, then the other and test blade play and smoothness. If there is blade play I barely turn one pivot screw. If play remains I barely turn the other one. Point is to keep the tightness of the pivot screws approx. the same. Then try tightening the other screws. The ones that go into the front of the backbar can effect tension but I don't think the back screw has any effect. But, since the problem lies in the pivot I'd try working on that to start with.

This is a suggestions that I have never tried because I've never had a problem with blade play when assembling a Manix2. My only "problem" area is getting the bearing/housing in place and holding it there until the second liner is in place holding it. The key here is to put the bearing assy in first, then pull them back and drop the blade in. I tried the blade first and never did get it to work so I re-watched the video I had and saw my problem.

Don't know if working on the pivot first will make a difference or not. Good luck.

Jack

[cesar]

witchcraft... could you post some detailed pics?

[cesar]

Any scratch noise when open/close?

[kbuzbee]

When you put the first pivot screw in to hole the post in place snug it up but don't tighten. Put all the screws in on that side of the knife but don't tighten, just snug. When it is all together try tightening the pivot screws first. Since there are two I snug one, then the other and test blade play and smoothness. If there is blade play I barely turn one pivot screw. If play remains I barely turn the other one. Point is to keep the tightness of the pivot screws approx. the same. Then try tightening the other screws. The ones that go into the front of the backbar can effect tension but I don't think the back screw has any effect. But, since the problem lies in the pivot I'd try working on that to start with.

I tried the pivot first, Jack, exactly as you describe. Later, on Graeme's recommendation, I tried the spacer screws first. No difference either way.

You're right, that ball bearing assembly can be a little son of a gun. Trick I learned today was to leave the rear back spacer screw engaged and pivot it over the ball bearing assembly to hold it in place while you're working on it (one time I launched the bearing clear across the living room. That was exciting)

witchcraft... could you post some detailed pics?

At this point, I'm down with witchcraft Pics won't really help. You can't SEE anything wrong, but you can feel it (okay, you can see the point of the blade as you move it between the liners, but you know what I mean) Everything is snug and flush, visually.

Any scratch noise when open/close?

Nope, it's smooth and quiet.

Ken

[David Lowry]

Take it apart again. Put it back together. This time flip the bushing that goes in the blade. Only tighten all the screws about 50%.

This has happened to me in the past and I found that for some reason the CBL needed to be able to put itself where it needed to be. I opened and closed the knife slowly a few times with the screws loosened and then I tightened the pivot almost all the way down. Then I tested to see if the play was gone. It wasn't so I sort of moved the handles up and down and sorta just played with them and then I heard the CBL sort of "click" into wherever it needed to be. After that I tightened everything down and all was good.

When I say "moved the handles up and down" what I mean is this: If you hold the knife with the back of the handle facing you and the blade tip facing away from you with the edge down and the knife open you will be able to hold a handle with each hand. You will be looking down on the spine of the knife. Like this you can grab each handle scale/liner and tweak them up and down and back and forth a little. Do it with the blade open and also with the blade closed and see if you can get a "click" and then see if the play goes away.

Let us know.

[cesar]

Life is better with some emotions... I will now disassemble my Manix to try to reproduce your scenario and try to find a solution. Keep tracking...

[kbuzbee]

This time flip the bushing that goes in the blade.

I'll give it another go, David. But what do you mean by the above line! Flip both bushings? Or which one?

Or do you mean the pivot itself?

Ken

[kbuzbee]

Life is better with some emotions... I will now disassemble my Manix to try to reproduce your scenario and try to find a solution. Keep tracking...

Thanks Caser. Let me know how it goes for you.

Ken