Sharpmaker and ZDP-189

[jackknifeh]

I found a few products.
One of them is 2.5 micron (cheap ebay) and is says oil based, is that a good thing oil based ?
Also you read a lot that diamond compound normally is supplied to maple or mdf, nothing about leather strop ... ?

The paste I got from ebay is oil based and works fine. Most directions for diamond paste, even the DMT stuff says to use it on harder surfaces. MDF, hard wood or even glass. My first experience with DMT diamond paste I used on glass and got my chisels really super sharp. I was planning on buying a new set because I just couldn't get them as sharp as chisels need to be. The paste saved me from buying new chisels and have provided outstanding strop compound. When I thought about using it on leather I called DMT and they said lots of people do that. They didn't have it in their documentation or videos though. That was about 3 years ago. Maybe they do now. It does work very well though. The "normal" strop compounds work good also I'm sure. I've just never used them. For a "get right now" good strop there is one on Knivesplus.com for around $20. I have one and it works real well. Probably the best deal if you want one right now without thinking about grits, leather type, etc. You also never have to charge it with compound again. Just moisten it with olive oil once in a while.

OFF SUBJECT:

Chuck and anyone else. I just started a new thread in off-topic concerning the EP and Congress Tools stones and thickness. Check it out. I think there's something to it. Someone else may have thought of it but I just thought of it. It's just way off subject for this thread.

Jack

[Bios]

The strops from knivesplus.com had my interest but they don't ship to the Netherlands, so no option for me.
But i don't think it will mather much which leather i use when you use a compount anyway.

[Bios]

Ok, thanks all for your support !
Have just ordered the spyderco sage 1 and sharpmaker with the diamond stones and ultra fine stones.
Will order a set of dmt diamond paste (6,3,1) and 3 strops
Hope i'm done for now, my wife is so gonna hate me when she finds out.

Can someone tell me how to adjust the diamond paste to the strops ?
And is 2 gr of this compound enough for a strop, it seems so little ....
I will order the strops on ebay (strops from R. Jones), maybe you can take a look, is this leather fine or does this not matter ?

[chuck_roxas45]

2 grams is plenty Bios. A little goes a long way with pastes.

[jackknifeh]

Ok, thanks all for your support !
Have just ordered the spyderco sage 1 and sharpmaker with the diamond stones and ultra fine stones.
Will order a set of dmt diamond paste (6,3,1) and 3 strops
Hope i'm done for now, my wife is so gonna hate me when she finds out.

Can someone tell me how to adjust the diamond paste to the strops ?
And is 2 gr of this compound enough for a strop, it seems so little ....
I will order the strops on ebay (strops from R. Jones), maybe you can take a look, is this leather fine or does this not matter ?

2 grams of each paste will last you a long time if all you use it for is the strops. My strops are 1.5" wide and about 10" long. I put a BB side dot about every 2" and rub that all over with my index finger. Just cover the entire area. Don't use so much that it can't be rubbed in pretty good. The first time you strop a knife if a little accumulates on the blade edge it's ok but it shouldn't happen all the time. With brand new leather you can apply it a second or third time in about a two week period. After that you'll be fine. You should be able to do that with at least 10 strops per tube. AT LEAST. Like Chuck said, it goes a long way.

Congrats on the Sage1 (great knife) and Sharpmaker. You are off and running on spending ALL of your money on knives. Next you need a Chaparral. It is a little smaller than the Sage1 but looks almost like it. Then when your wife sees you use it and says "Is that a new knife?" you can say "nope, same one". She'll look like something is different but not know exactly what. That happened to me and wife. I did tell her it was a new one though.

Jack

Jack

[chuck_roxas45]

2 grams of each paste will last you a long time if all you use it for is the strops. My strops are 1.5" wide and about 10" long. I put a BB side dot about every 2" and rub that all over with my index finger. Just cover the entire area. Don't use so much that it can't be rubbed in pretty good. The first time you strop a knife if a little accumulates on the blade edge it's ok but it shouldn't happen all the time. With brand new leather you can apply it a second or third time in about a two week period. After that you'll be fine. You should be able to do that with at least 10 strops per tube. AT LEAST. Like Chuck said, it goes a long way.

Congrats on the Sage1 (great knife) and Sharpmaker. You are off and running on spending ALL of your money on knives. Next you need a Chaparral. It is a little smaller than the Sage1 but looks almost like it. Then when your wife sees you use it and says "Is that a new knife?" you can say "nope, same one". She'll look like something is different but not know exactly what. That happened to me and wife. I did tell her it was a new one though.

Jack

Jack

Jack is an enabler.

[Bios]

Haha, that's an idea Jack.
Unfortunately my wife also does the finance here at home, maybe i have to take it over from her.
But now she has really sharp knives in the kitchen (depending on my skills).

More knives are coming, ik know for sure, the sage 1 is more the basic edc knife, maybe a smaller one dragonfly and a bigger one in the future para 2.
Now i will order some leather, good thing you said which size you use, there are strops in all sizes.

[jackknifeh]

Haha, that's an idea Jack.
Unfortunately my wife also does the finance here at home, maybe i have to take it over from her.
But now she has really sharp knives in the kitchen (depending on my skills).

More knives are coming, ik know for sure, the sage 1 is more the basic edc knife, maybe a smaller one dragonfly and a bigger one in the future para 2.
Now i will order some leather, good thing you said which size you use, there are strops in all sizes.

Wilderness Survivor asked about this "strop bat" in a thread a while ago.
http://jreindustries.com/strops.htm

I loved the idea. You can order one with different compounds or without any so you can use your own. I made one out of a 2"x2", whittled a handle and put diamond paste of different grits on it. I use this all the time. Very compact, all grits are on the same strop.

I plan on making a few more for gifts or maybe different leather. Horse hide is much harder than cow hide for a different preference.

Just a thought.

Jack

[Bios]

Wilderness Survivor asked about this "strop bat" in a thread a while ago.
http://jreindustries.com/strops.htm

I loved the idea. You can order one with different compounds or without any so you can use your own. I made one out of a 2"x2", whittled a handle and put diamond paste of different grits on it. I use this all the time. Very compact, all grits are on the same strop.

I plan on making a few more for gifts or maybe different leather. Horse hide is much harder than cow hide for a different preference.

Just a thought.

Jack

Looks nice indeed, i have sent a mail to him

[Fancier]

I find a decent triplet 10x hand lens to be essential to all of my sharpening. With that level of magnification you can take a pass across the knife, inspect the scratch pattern, and adjust your technique to compensate to get the bevel just right. You can also inspect the bevels on both sides to ensure that they are uniform, because you may find your technique to be a bit different on one side than the other. I also keep a shopping bag of scrap paper next to my work area because I enjoy shaving thin strips off the edges of a sheet of paper once I'm done.

[chuck_roxas45]

I find a decent triplet 10x hand lens to be essential to all of my sharpening. With that level of magnification you can take a pass across the knife, inspect the scratch pattern, and adjust your technique to compensate to get the bevel just right. You can also inspect the bevels on both sides to ensure that they are uniform, because you may find your technique to be a bit different on one side than the other. I also keep a shopping bag of scrap paper next to my work area because I enjoy shaving thin strips off the edges of a sheet of paper once I'm done.

Yep, as Sal says loupe no. 1 teacher.

[Bios]

What wil be the difference if i use this JRE strop with compounds or adjust self diamond paste ?
Does these compounds also have a certain kind of grit/ micron level ?
I know you begin with the black compound, then green, then pink and as last the black leather.
So if i sharpened my knife as last with the sharpmaker ultra-fine stones, i have to begin with black ?
What will be the difference between the ultra-fine stones and the difference colours compounds ?

Also a personal question for who can help me out ;

I wanna order the DMT DIA-Paste kit of 3 tubes (6,3,1 micron) but can't find a shop that can deliver to the Netherlands....there are some shops that do but they charge you $30 OR $40 shipping costs.
That's a little high compared with the price of this set (around $25).
Knows somebody a site who's selling this kit and ships to the Netherlands without super high delivery costs ?
Or can someone of you sent me this paste-kit ? I will pay off course in front for all the costs and am willing to pay some more for the effort or i can sent you something from the Netherlands if you like that (wooden shoes haha)

[Bios]

The spyderco sage 1 has arrived and i am not disappointed
Its sitting in my pocket right now, you total forget that's it there actually.
Together with it came the sharpmaker and diamond- and ultrafine stones.
Leather strops and dmt paste on their way ...... a member of bladeforums was so kind to sent me the dmt paste and the strops.
Have seen the dvd which came with the sharpmaker but still some question about the sharpmaker and the back bevel and micro bevel ....

The steel of the sage 1 is s30v as you al know, can this hold a 30 degree micro bevel ?
And how do you accomplish a micro bevel of 40 degrees and a 30 degrees back bevel ?
Do you use all the stones (diamond,medium,fine,ultrafine,strop) for the back bevel and to the same thing for the micro bevel ?

[jackknifeh]

The spyderco sage 1 has arrived and i am not disappointed
Its sitting in my pocket right now, you total forget that's it there actually.
Together with it came the sharpmaker and diamond- and ultrafine stones.
Leather strops and dmt paste on their way ...... a member of bladeforums was so kind to sent me the dmt paste and the strops.
Have seen the dvd which came with the sharpmaker but still some question about the sharpmaker and the back bevel and micro bevel ....

The steel of the sage 1 is s30v as you al know, can this hold a 30 degree micro bevel ?
And how do you accomplish a micro bevel of 40 degrees and a 30 degrees back bevel ?
Do you use all the stones (diamond,medium,fine,ultrafine,strop) for the back bevel and to the same thing for the micro bevel ?

Very glad to hear you got your knife and sharpening set. When the strops and paste arrive you will have all you need. Congratulations.

Which rods you use will be determined by the condition of the knife you are sharpening. If it is just a little bit dull you can use the fine and/or ultra fine stones to get it sharp again. If it is real dull you will need the coarser stones to remove more steel. You will probably want to watch the DVD that came with the Sharpmaker at least two times, maybe more. Which compounds on the strops you use will also be determined by the condition of the edge. As a rule with strops always start with the coarsest and work toward the finest grit. The knife needs to be very sharp before using a strop. That is essential. Your own experience will teach you more than we can (or I can). Have fun and the sharp knives will come.

Jack
PS edit: Remember, one compound for each strop. You can't mix them on the same strop. Well, you can go coarser from a finer grit but I'd make sure to stay with the same grit on each strop you start with.

[Bios]

Jack and other forum members.
I get the picture of the different kind of grits.
The steps to work to a nice mirror 30 degree edge is clear for me.
I think that i will try a 30 degree edge the first time i sharpen the knife and hope it's holding well, otherwise i can alway go back to a 40 degree micro bevel, right ?
The one thing i am not 100% sure is how to accomplish the 40 degree mico bevel....
Should i start with 20 strokes fine, ultrafine, rod for mirror polish, same steps as with the 30 degree back bevel ?
Or don't i have to do so much strokes and can i start with a higher grit ?

[jackknifeh]

Jack and other forum members.
I get the picture of the different kind of grits.
The steps to work to a nice mirror 30 degree edge is clear for me.
I think that i will try a 30 degree edge the first time i sharpen the knife and hope it's holding well, otherwise i can alway go back to a 40 degree micro bevel, right ?
Exactly right.

The one thing i am not 100% sure is how to accomplish the 40 degree mico bevel....
Should i start with 20 strokes fine, ultrafine, rod for mirror polish, same steps as with the 30 degree back bevel ?
Or don't i have to do so much strokes and can i start with a higher grit ?

Set Sharpmaker to the 40° setting (of course). I would start with 5 strokes each side when creating a micro bevel (or even 3 strokes). Using fewer strokes will give you a better mental picture of how much steel is being removed per stroke, or per set of 5 strokes. Especially with a micro bevel. You will not remove very much steel at all. I believe the "number of strokes" is a guideline mainly so you use the same number on both sides. There WILL BE A TIME when you want to use 5 strokes on one side and 20 strokes on the other side. Not to worry about that now with your new knife. Just keep it in mind that the number of strokes will be determined by what needs to be done to the edge.

I would start with the fine grit rods. Always (almost) start with the finer grit stones or rods when sharpening. If it isn't removing enough steel fast enough you can always change to a coarser grit. If you start with a coarser grit and find it removed too much steel you can't put the steel back. After some experience with the different grits and different steels you will know what to start with that works for you. Until then start with the finer ones. But, starting with the UF is not necessary because it's a given it won't remove enough steel. It is a finishing stone and removes a very small amount of steel.

If you want to whip out a sharp knife fast put the coarse grit rods in the 40° position, do 20 strokes per side (give or take) and you will have a very sharp knife after removing any burrs. But, if you want an edge that is even on both sides, edge in the center of the blade and a mirror finish, start with fewer strokes and finer grits. That's how I do it anyway. The effect a particular grit will have on the edge will be determined by how hard the steel is and MAINLY your technique. How much pressure you use compared to someone else makes it hard for someone to forcast the results you will have. Does that make sense?

Hope this helps. Of course don't take my info as gospel. It's how I see sharpening and also how I write it. Other's will have different ideas that work for them. It's amazing how many people have different techniques and opinions and most end up with sharp knives. Kinda cool I think. Have fun.

Jack

[Bios]

Ok, thanks Jack.
Think i got the idea now right
I first will do some sharpening on a few old kitchen knives.

[Bios]

So, 1 kitchen knife is already sharp, at least a lot sharper than is was before
I took a while, longer than i thought it would take, and the knife was of x45 crmov steel (or something like that)
I don't think that is one of the harder steels to sharpen.
But i take tomorrow some more knives with me to work, so i can exercise with the sharpmaker.

I have read that it's important not let the tip come off the stone because it will be rounded that way.
Is that also the advice when you sharpen with the corner of the stones (steps 1 and 3) ? Because it's hard to let the tip not come off the corner of the stones....
Or do they mean the flat side of the stones ?
I think there will be not much damage when you use the fine stones but can imagine with the ceramic medium stones that the risk is higher, right ?

[donutsrule]

Well, I decided to have at my $24 ZDP Delica (not FFG) for the first time with the diamond rods to set the back bevel, and quickly discovered with a sharpie and a cheap loupe that the left side was already at 30 while the right was nowhere near it.

Do I just keep at the right side for an hour or so until I've (almost?) got a burr, or is there some reason to give the left any attention during this?