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Thread: Under the microscope

  1. #21
    Spyderco Forum Registered User dbcad's Avatar
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    Magnification is always enlightening, being able to share that information via sharp pictures is not that easy. Thanks Clip

    You can learn a lot from magnification. My own 15X lighted loupe opened a whole new world in edges with my failing eyes.

    A 100X or 200X would be interesting to see, especially to notice the variability within a single sharp knife's edge
    Charlie

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  2. #22
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Clip's Avatar
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    Pictures from today, still freshly sharpened.

    The metallograph has a color camera and 50-1000x capability. Although the lenses are labeled with those magnifications, I think they're slightly different (comparing 63x on the stereo microscope and the 50x on the metallograph, they don't match up)

    Also, found the option in the program to take a multi-layered picture so now the high mag pics are sharp with no DOF issues.

    50x



    100x - should've taken a multilayer here but didn't think about it. At this level and above, you can really start to see how the blade is wearing. I'm excited to see how different steels compare at 100-200x because I think that'll give me some idea of how the edges deteriorate over time (whether by rolling or chipping, etc).



    200x - as I mentioned before, I retook these next pictures to get rid of the DOF issues. I hate that I wasn't able to find the exact spot I had before, but at 200x the blade seems a mile long through the eyepiece. I'll make sure to hold it still in the upcoming pictures.



    500x



    1000x

    Last edited by Clip; 05-03-2012 at 05:29 PM.
    Click here to zoom: Under the Microscope

    Manix2, Elmax MT13, M4 Manix2, ZDP Caly3, ZDP Caly Jr, SB Caly3.5, M390 Para2, Cruwear MT12, Techno, XHP MT16, South Fork, SB Caly3, Manix2 Ltwt, Salt I, 20CP Para2, Military Left Hand, Perrin PPT, Forum Native5, Squeak, Manix 83mm, 440V Military, Gayle Bradley, Swick3, Lil' Temperance, Cruwear Military, VG10 Jester, Terzuola SlipIt, XHP Native Ltwt, Domino, CPM154/S90V Para2, SB Stretch, D2 Para, Dfly2 Salt, Tasman Salt

    Chris

  3. #23
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Clip's Avatar
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    dbcad, ask and you shall receive.
    Click here to zoom: Under the Microscope

    Manix2, Elmax MT13, M4 Manix2, ZDP Caly3, ZDP Caly Jr, SB Caly3.5, M390 Para2, Cruwear MT12, Techno, XHP MT16, South Fork, SB Caly3, Manix2 Ltwt, Salt I, 20CP Para2, Military Left Hand, Perrin PPT, Forum Native5, Squeak, Manix 83mm, 440V Military, Gayle Bradley, Swick3, Lil' Temperance, Cruwear Military, VG10 Jester, Terzuola SlipIt, XHP Native Ltwt, Domino, CPM154/S90V Para2, SB Stretch, D2 Para, Dfly2 Salt, Tasman Salt

    Chris

  4. #24
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    Absolutely _amazing_ photos!
    Many thanks for showing them to us.

    I very much like how you are able to combine multiple images (multi-layered) into a single image to avoid the problem with depth-of-focus. Those very high magnification images are beautiful.

    Do you do requests?
    (1) Can we suggest you to try some stuff? (ie: specific knife + specific sharpening + cutting tests) You can always say no. ^^;
    (2) Would you take photos of knives we lend to you? (To check our own sharpening technique and cut tests.)
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  5. #25
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Clip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lagrangian View Post
    Absolutely _amazing_ photos!
    Many thanks for showing them to us.

    I very much like how you are able to combine multiple images (multi-layered) into a single image to avoid the problem with depth-of-focus. Those very high magnification images are beautiful.

    Do you do requests?
    (1) Can we suggest you to try some stuff? (ie: specific knife + specific sharpening + cutting tests) You can always say no. ^^;
    (2) Would you take photos of knives we lend to you? (To check our own sharpening technique and cut tests.)
    Thanks! The DOF issue was killing me until I dug out the manual and found some more functionality with the program. On my Canon I would've just cranked the aperture up and dragged the shutter to compensate for reduced light.

    Requests:
    I'd love for you guys to throw ideas out there, and I wouldn't mind trying them if they sound reasonable and I've got some spare time to use the equipment. I think it'd be neat to try apples-to-apples comparisons. Gimme some suggestions!

    As for taking pictures of knives you guys lend: Again, wouldn't mind doing this at all. I think it'd be a great way to test way more steels, grinds, and sharpening techniques than I could ever get my hands on. I'd like input from members more experienced in shipping and receiving to chime in with a process that works for them and keeps everyone happy.

    So yes to both!
    Click here to zoom: Under the Microscope

    Manix2, Elmax MT13, M4 Manix2, ZDP Caly3, ZDP Caly Jr, SB Caly3.5, M390 Para2, Cruwear MT12, Techno, XHP MT16, South Fork, SB Caly3, Manix2 Ltwt, Salt I, 20CP Para2, Military Left Hand, Perrin PPT, Forum Native5, Squeak, Manix 83mm, 440V Military, Gayle Bradley, Swick3, Lil' Temperance, Cruwear Military, VG10 Jester, Terzuola SlipIt, XHP Native Ltwt, Domino, CPM154/S90V Para2, SB Stretch, D2 Para, Dfly2 Salt, Tasman Salt

    Chris

  6. #26
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    Fantastic images! Thanks for sharing.

    I'd love to see as many comparisons as you can muster.
    Do no harm. Do know harm.

  7. #27
    Spyderco Forum Registered User computernut's Avatar
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    Nice photos! I was thinking of getting a 15x loupe but 1000x is impressive!

  8. #28
    Spyderco Forum Registered User phillipsted's Avatar
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    Wow. You can see the way the steel "smears" as you sharpen it - I'd love to see a burr at this magnification - I bet it would look like a big wave cresting at Oahu.

    TedP
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  9. #29
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    Wow, very cool, thanks for sharing!
    Jerry

  10. #30
    Spyderco Forum Registered User dbcad's Avatar
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    Terrific pictures!!!!, Thanks Clip, I do want a microscope, but a good one is beyond my reach. Your pictures are quite interesting. What blade material are you looking at? It would be very interesting to compare images like these between different blade materials.

    Absolutely fascinating what magnification can show you
    Charlie

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    "Integrity is being good even if no one is watching"

  11. #31
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Clip's Avatar
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    Thanks guys! I should've mentioned it in the first post and I'll update. This is hollow-ground 154CM on the Manix2. I sharpened it on the 17 setting on the Lansky sharpener and when measuring with my calipers, I calculated it was something like a 28 inclusive angle.

    Monday I should be able to check factory sharpened Elmax, CPM-M4 and CPM-S30V. Another test I've been thinking of is prepping and polishing the 154CM followed by etching to try and look at the carbides. If it works and I can repeat the process with the other blades I'll be able to compare carbides in the different steels.
    Click here to zoom: Under the Microscope

    Manix2, Elmax MT13, M4 Manix2, ZDP Caly3, ZDP Caly Jr, SB Caly3.5, M390 Para2, Cruwear MT12, Techno, XHP MT16, South Fork, SB Caly3, Manix2 Ltwt, Salt I, 20CP Para2, Military Left Hand, Perrin PPT, Forum Native5, Squeak, Manix 83mm, 440V Military, Gayle Bradley, Swick3, Lil' Temperance, Cruwear Military, VG10 Jester, Terzuola SlipIt, XHP Native Ltwt, Domino, CPM154/S90V Para2, SB Stretch, D2 Para, Dfly2 Salt, Tasman Salt

    Chris

  12. #32
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Clip's Avatar
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    Received the M4 Manix2 and the S30V Dodo today. Threw the Dodo onto the table and got factory edge pictures at 10, 25, 40 and 63x. I should be able to get the higher-mag ones as well this evening. Don't know if I'll be able to do the Elmax and M4 today but there's going to be something new in this thread tonight!
    Click here to zoom: Under the Microscope

    Manix2, Elmax MT13, M4 Manix2, ZDP Caly3, ZDP Caly Jr, SB Caly3.5, M390 Para2, Cruwear MT12, Techno, XHP MT16, South Fork, SB Caly3, Manix2 Ltwt, Salt I, 20CP Para2, Military Left Hand, Perrin PPT, Forum Native5, Squeak, Manix 83mm, 440V Military, Gayle Bradley, Swick3, Lil' Temperance, Cruwear Military, VG10 Jester, Terzuola SlipIt, XHP Native Ltwt, Domino, CPM154/S90V Para2, SB Stretch, D2 Para, Dfly2 Salt, Tasman Salt

    Chris

  13. #33
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Donut's Avatar
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    Chris, I was wondering if you're locked at a 90 degree straight angle? What kind of view of the Spyder logo texturing would you be able to give us?
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  14. #34
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Clip's Avatar
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    The metallograph is built for a 90 angle so you can put mounted samples on the stage and look at them. Since the light comes up through the lens, reflects, and goes back down this works the best. However, I've been throwing the knives up any way I can get them to cooperate with the combination of stage and lens and it's working fine. I usually have to crank the light way up to get enough to reflect back to give me a decent picture. I'll try a few different angles pointing at the bug tomorrow to see.
    Click here to zoom: Under the Microscope

    Manix2, Elmax MT13, M4 Manix2, ZDP Caly3, ZDP Caly Jr, SB Caly3.5, M390 Para2, Cruwear MT12, Techno, XHP MT16, South Fork, SB Caly3, Manix2 Ltwt, Salt I, 20CP Para2, Military Left Hand, Perrin PPT, Forum Native5, Squeak, Manix 83mm, 440V Military, Gayle Bradley, Swick3, Lil' Temperance, Cruwear Military, VG10 Jester, Terzuola SlipIt, XHP Native Ltwt, Domino, CPM154/S90V Para2, SB Stretch, D2 Para, Dfly2 Salt, Tasman Salt

    Chris

  15. #35
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Clip's Avatar
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    As promised, here are pictures of a factory fresh orange S30V Dodo. Looks like the blade is sharpened at a steeper angle on the bug side compared to the origin side. I'll try and get pictures of the slightly different grind tomorrow. The 10-63x pictures were on the origin side, what I guess is close to a 20 angle on my Lansky sharpener. The pictures from 50-1000x are on the bug side, 17 according to Lansky . I got a good technique down with this blade because it was so short. We'll see if it works tomorrow on the M4 Manix.

    On these next four pictures, it almost looks like the factory puts an extremely small secondary bevel on the edge. The light seems to catch or dodge it. On the higher magnifications where I was looking at the 'belly' of the hawkbill, I didn't see the same thing happening.


    10x -


    25x



    40x



    63x



    50x



    100x



    200x



    500x



    1000x

    Last edited by Clip; 05-03-2012 at 05:36 PM.
    Click here to zoom: Under the Microscope

    Manix2, Elmax MT13, M4 Manix2, ZDP Caly3, ZDP Caly Jr, SB Caly3.5, M390 Para2, Cruwear MT12, Techno, XHP MT16, South Fork, SB Caly3, Manix2 Ltwt, Salt I, 20CP Para2, Military Left Hand, Perrin PPT, Forum Native5, Squeak, Manix 83mm, 440V Military, Gayle Bradley, Swick3, Lil' Temperance, Cruwear Military, VG10 Jester, Terzuola SlipIt, XHP Native Ltwt, Domino, CPM154/S90V Para2, SB Stretch, D2 Para, Dfly2 Salt, Tasman Salt

    Chris

  16. #36
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    That 1000x magnification is nuts. Love it. That dodos not chipped but seems to have a wavy edge. But thats why sometimes all you need to do is a few mintues of stropping and you can totally transform and edge from crazy sharp to, holy crap laser sharp.
    Manix 2 DLC, Delica 4 FFG, Ladybug 3,County Comm H1 Ladybug 3 , Endura 4 FFG G10, C94 UKPK Leaf, Atlantic Salt, Military Camo DLC,Sage 1 Para 2 DLC, Delica 4.

  17. #37
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Clip's Avatar
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    Speaking of, does anyone have a good link on how to get started stropping?
    Click here to zoom: Under the Microscope

    Manix2, Elmax MT13, M4 Manix2, ZDP Caly3, ZDP Caly Jr, SB Caly3.5, M390 Para2, Cruwear MT12, Techno, XHP MT16, South Fork, SB Caly3, Manix2 Ltwt, Salt I, 20CP Para2, Military Left Hand, Perrin PPT, Forum Native5, Squeak, Manix 83mm, 440V Military, Gayle Bradley, Swick3, Lil' Temperance, Cruwear Military, VG10 Jester, Terzuola SlipIt, XHP Native Ltwt, Domino, CPM154/S90V Para2, SB Stretch, D2 Para, Dfly2 Salt, Tasman Salt

    Chris

  18. #38
    Spyderco Forum Registered User C.L.L 97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clip View Post
    Speaking of, does anyone have a good link on how to get started stropping?
    Look up stropman.com(great strops). The pics are great, I never thought that's what a knife edge would look like,it's really cool...

    I have a question about loupes, what is the best ones to get,and how much do they go for??
    Thanks
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  19. #39
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Clip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C.L.L 97 View Post
    Look up stropman.com(great strops). The pics are great, I never thought that's what a knife edge would look like,it's really cool...

    I have a question about loupes, what is the best ones to get,and how much do they go for??
    Thanks
    I'm sure people more knowledgeable will chime in but I think people get something in the 10-20x range.
    Click here to zoom: Under the Microscope

    Manix2, Elmax MT13, M4 Manix2, ZDP Caly3, ZDP Caly Jr, SB Caly3.5, M390 Para2, Cruwear MT12, Techno, XHP MT16, South Fork, SB Caly3, Manix2 Ltwt, Salt I, 20CP Para2, Military Left Hand, Perrin PPT, Forum Native5, Squeak, Manix 83mm, 440V Military, Gayle Bradley, Swick3, Lil' Temperance, Cruwear Military, VG10 Jester, Terzuola SlipIt, XHP Native Ltwt, Domino, CPM154/S90V Para2, SB Stretch, D2 Para, Dfly2 Salt, Tasman Salt

    Chris

  20. #40
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    The wavy edge on the Dodo appears to be the result of the deeper cuts. They continue all the way to the edge and it is particularly evident in the 100x and 200x views. I would like to see if that wavyness straightens out by removing those deeper cuts after reprofiling with higher grits (such as choseras).

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