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Thread: Boye detent

  1. #1
    Spyderco Forum Registered User catamount's Avatar
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    Boye detent

    How well does it work in peoples experience? I've seen some say they prefer not to have it, and I am curious why.
    Tom
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  2. #2
    Spyderco Forum Registered User pjrocco's Avatar
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    I really dislike it. IMO, it takes away from the natural flow of the handle.. and it makes it hard to disengage the lock...
    Rock

  3. #3
    Spyderco Forum Registered User STR's Avatar
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    For the mid lock folders when white knuckling the knives (that is gripping extremely hard so your knuckles get white) there have been reports of the lock depressing just enough to cause the blade to disengage or move. When David Boye came up with the idea it was because of a practical need. I can't find them to give you links but I recall reading reviews by Cliff Stamp where he pointed out how ones he tested that didn't have it did see lock bar movement in white knuckling use and the new knives tested that had the detent were markedly improved in performance even though everything else about them was the same.

    I have a Catcherman in the AUS8 steel blade that was made before the detent was being used and one of the newer MBS26 Catchermans that has it and I have seen the lock bar move on the older one just from using it in the kitchen so I think there is a definite improvement and need for it. Some maybe more noticed and more needed than others for sure. I have noted that the new 80mm Manix and others in the line up don't have it so apparently Spyderco feels the same way.

    Thats my take on it anyway.

    STR
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    Spyderco Forum Registered User smcfalls13's Avatar
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    I'm neutral on this issue. It doesn't bother me, but neither does it excite me. As long as it has a lock, and a blade, and a hole
    Scott

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  5. #5
    Spyderco Forum Registered User The Deacon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by catamount
    How well does it work in peoples experience? I've seen some say they prefer not to have it, and I am curious why.
    My reasons for disliking it are many.

    First, it is ugly. As Rock pointed out, it ruins the flow of the backstrap, just as a dent in your auto's fender would spoil the lines of your car. I also creates one more unnecessary opportunity for a "cosmetic defect" by looking even worse when not centered in the lock recess. If every knife with an off-center Boye dent had to be sold as a "factory second" I think Spyderco would stop using it within a month. One of these days, when I have the time, I will put together a "freak show" photo gallery of off center, crooked, and lopsided Boye dents.

    Second, it is used in such illogical ways. It is suppose to reduce the risk of accidentally disengaging the lock during SD or other hard usage. The Chinook, Manix, and 80mm Manix, all of which, if not specifically intended for SD, are unquestionably suitable for it, lack the Boye dent. Yet the Kopa and Jester, arguably the least SD / hard use oriented front locks in the lineup, have it.

    Which leads directly into number three. The concept itself is somewhat illogical. You are attempting to prevent accidental opening by creating a spot on the lock release to which a finger will gravitate without conscious effort.

    As for how well it works. I must admit I have never had a knife with a Boye dent accidentally open, or come close to accidentally opening. Of course, I have not had a knife without a Boye dent do either of those things either. At best, it would be close to impossible to determine if, on a particular blow, struck by a particular individual, the presence or absence of a Boye dent would have affected the outcome one way or the other. I think "placebo" is probably the best description for it, but there is no way to prove, or disprove, that.
    Paul
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    Spyderco Forum Registered User DAYWALKER's Avatar
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    Aloha ALL,

    Welp...FWIW, I have been playing with non-dented 's for years...none of which accidentally unlocked. Deacon raised some good points, and well, for me, it just detracts.

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  7. #7
    Spyderco Forum Registered User greencobra's Avatar
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    I agree with Rock and Deacon on this. I dislike it to no end, serving in my view, no esthetical or practical use. It must be there for some liability purpose is all I can figure on this.

    As for my own unscientific tests, with an older FRN Endura I have without the dent, I can't make the lock budge no matter what position I grip it in or how hard I white knuckle it. Maybe if they were worried about it being white knucked closed, a stronger lock spring would have been the answer instead of the dent.

  8. #8
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Slvgx's Avatar
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    I am do not really care either way. If they were all without a dent, then the user could dent it themselves, doesn't work the other way. It is kinda funny to me that the Jester has one while the Manix does not, but I'm not a knife designer, so meh!
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  9. #9
    Spyderco Forum Registered User foggy's Avatar
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    I don't even notice it both in looks and function.

  10. #10
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    I just posted this on Deacon's Remote Release thread;

    We don't put the "Boye dent" on all locks, it depends on the curve of the spine of the handle, the size and shape of the lock bar detent in the handle, the depth of the lock hammer and the size of the knife. It's a safety feature where needed. As we design or re-design, we look closely at that feature. We've heard that there are a few of our ELUs that actually don't like the dent .

    So we try to keep an open mind. We won't sacrifice safety for looks, but we'll always look at all of the possible ways to solve a problem.

    sal

  11. #11
    Spyderco Forum Registered User pjrocco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sal
    I just posted this on Deacon's Remote Release thread;

    We don't put the "Boye dent" on all locks, it depends on the curve of the spine of the handle, the size and shape of the lock bar detent in the handle, the depth of the lock hammer and the size of the knife. It's a safety feature where needed. As we design or re-design, we look closely at that feature. We've heard that there are a few of our ELUs that actually don't like the dent .

    So we try to keep an open mind. We won't sacrifice safety for looks, but we'll always look at all of the possible ways to solve a problem.

    sal
    Thanks Sal....

    That's good to know... Hopefully, more designs in the future will NOT have the "Dent"...

    But, on the other hand.. I'd rather have it, and be safe.. Than not have it, and have something go wrong...
    Rock

  12. #12
    Spyderco Forum Registered User STR's Avatar
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    The Boye detent is supposed to make the lock harder to disengage. That is the idea behind it from what I understand. But it is not impossible.

    creates one more unnecessary opportunity for a "cosmetic defect" by looking even worse when not centered in the lock recess. If every knife with an off-center Boye dent had to be sold as a "factory second" I think Spyderco would stop using it within a month. One of these days, when I have the time, I will put together a "freak show" photo gallery of off center, crooked, and lopsided Boye dents.
    Ok this is where some pictures are needed.

    Pic number one shows my Salt 1 that I upgraded the body on. Notice the off center Boye detent when the knife sits closed. It also looks this way when the blade is locked open. I just figured most anyone that was into Spyderco knives took it for granted that they were more into feel and function than looks. Looks have always been secondary to them. So what if it is off center when not used right?

    Now look at it when it is depressed to unlock the blade. Notice how it is nearly perfectly centered then? Try this with any you think look funny and it will be the same story.

    STR
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  13. #13
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Spud Man's Avatar
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    I think Dialex gave a very good expanation of why the manix doesn't have a dent. I can't find it with the search though.

    I like the dent because it makes it very easy and comfortable to unlock the knife. My thumb fits perfectly in the dent.

    By the way STR, that is a very nice salt. Does it float?
    Veritas liberabit vos.

    Spuds are good.

  14. #14
    Spyderco Forum Registered User STR's Avatar
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    Nope. Lignum Vitae wood sinks like a rock but it is as durable and long lasting as the H1 steel will be and has a long history of marine use so I thought it fit the Salt knife.

    Thanks for the compliment. It is one of my most frequently carried knives. Titanium lined and all titanium screws including a custom made pivot pin I fabricated just for this knife. I have over $60 in just the titanium screws. Kind of funny since the knife was bought used for $20.

    STR
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  15. #15
    Spyderco Forum Registered User Simon G's Avatar
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    I for one, very much like the "operation" of the dent, but boy, do I hate how it looks!
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    Someone needs to defend the dent

    ...and it might as well be me.

    When I compare the knives I have without the Boye Dent to those with the Dent, there is no doubt in my hand that the Dent makes the lock easier to find and less likely to depress accidentally.

    I don't think it changes the esthetic appeal of the knives significantly. Given the choice of two identical knives differing only in the presence of a dent, I would pick the one with the dent.

    Now, all of my twenty-plus knives are users. I can understand that a collector would feel differently. For me, function is the first requirement -- sometimes a small, general purpose blade to carry in the pocket of nice slacks, sometimes a large, strong framelock on a lanyard to help cut cable and boxes when I'm out doing theatre tech work, and sometimes something to fidget with when I'm sitting in front of a computer for eight hours.

  17. #17
    Spyderco Forum Registered User STR's Avatar
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    I guess I'm surprised by all this sensitivity to looks by Spyderco ELUs. Since when has any Spyderco been a knife to win a beauty contest? Part of the reason I only gave them a passing glance at best for years was because they were just dawg ugly knives. Fugly ugly as some have put it. It wasn't until I put one in my hand that I realized they may be ugly to the eye but they are sure beautiful to the hand.

    Why else do you think I love Waving Spydercos so much? It improves their looks> Ok kidding and debateable I know. But all kidding aside Spyderco never much focused on esthetics or looks at all and to be honest it does amaze me that some fans are so critical of looks on a knife that is already ugly by most peoples' standards.

    STR
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  18. #18
    Spyderco Forum Registered User ruxton's Avatar
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    I like them, makes it easier to find the lock release at night. I kind of like the look of it too, ignoring that it's there to prevent accidental closing, the reason I would want one on a knife is to make it easier to close, running your thumb down the back of the spine with no boye dent you have to either know instinctively where the lock release is from using it every day or feel where the scales are cut out around the dent.

    Although to be honest I really am not a fan of back locks, give me a compression lock any day, even a liner lock.

  19. #19
    Spyderco Forum Registered User BlackNinja's Avatar
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    I'm with Rock and Deacon but, it doesn't really bother me as much. Deacon did have some real good points in his post that I do agree with.
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  20. #20
    Spyderco Forum Registered User WOTANSON1's Avatar
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    I don't have an opinion either way, though if it adds a measure of safety, well imho it can't be that bad, that said I've never had a non dent knife disengage accidentally.

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