Is HAP40 prone to chipping?

[Surfingringo]

Because we were able to deduce an expectation for s110v based on its predecessors and steel intent. I'm ecstatic that Spyderco gives us all these steels, that's one reason why I only buy Spydercos. I'm simply questioning this one steel. I'll get it, try it out. I'm not a super hard user, but in my mind I sort of dream of becoming a hardcore outdoors man one day, so maybe that's why I want my steel to be tough lol. If I have chipping issues, which I doubt I will, I guess I just won't use this for hard use.

I have a couple of customs in m4 that I have used pretty hard cleaning and steaking fish. They are both thinner behind the edge than a typical production folder yet I have had less micro chipping than i have with production folders in s30v, 204p, vg10 and s90v. If Cliff is correct and we get edge performance/stability out of this steel that is anything like m4 then I would expect it to be less prone to chipping than some of the steels you mentioned. Of course, i'm comparing different blades with different geometries and different ht's so this is like comparing apples and alligators, but what the ****, that's my prediction. :)

[animportant]

If hap40 turns out to perform like m4 here, this will be the bomb diggity

[Joshua J.]

If all we really end up with is a good Japanese source for an M-4 equivalent, I think that's still a solid win for everybody.

I wonder if we couldn't get the Santoku made up in HAP40 (I guess we'll see how badly it rusts). People really need to check that thing out, crazy geometry out the wazoo. Not quite German Windmill knives crazy, but super thin edge geometry even as far as kitchen knives go.
(I guess we would want to make sure that asking them to start grinding supersteel isn't going to cause an international incident either. Apparently a lot of personal relations work went into getting those knives on the market again.)

[araneae]

Well, this thread started with little actual evidence of HAP40 chipping other than a warning from a kitchen knife maker, which seems like sensible advice for all fine edged kitchen knives- don't cut frozen foods or bones (doesn't everyone have a beater in the kitchen for this?); and a couple anecdotal observations. It was certainly illustrative to see how several on the CS forum view many of us here.

While I don't consider myself a super steel junky by any measure (I have been known to be happy using 8Cr13) I do appreciate Sal's willingness to try new things and let us do so too. Variety is the spice of life, why not appreciate the chance to try it yourself, rather than crap on it from behind a computer? I will likely end up with one of these knives and draw my own conclusions.

[arty]

I have kitchen knives in VG10, S35V, XHP, M2, and plain carbon steel. The edge geometry matters, as does hardness. I have read some good reviews of Hap40 at kitchen knife websites.

If a blade has a fine edge and is too hard for the steel it is made of, you can get chipping. I have read lots of complaints about Shun VG10, but Spyderco's VG10 works fine, and my monster VG10 Western Deba has gone through lots of chicken bones and lobster shells without chipping. It does have a thick convex edge. I have used knives in XHP and S35V around bones without any chipping. S35V works fine as a kitchen boning knife, but I would like to see some pocket knives in HAP40.

[Ankerson]

I guess I'm one of those that likes to experience things for myself and I would guess a lot of you are that way. It's a lot different going 120 on a scooter than it is reading about going 120 on a scooter.

I know you will find it hard to believe that someone will actually lie to you to get your money. :eek: I try to be straight. The use of these odd runs of steel gives me, and you the opportunity to do some of our own testing and learning. I get to learn from my own experiences and also get to share what I learn with what you learn. I don't think we hype much, though others might. In any case, I am available for questioning.

sal

Hi Sal,

Looks like an interesting steel.

I also prefer to have hands on before making any judgments or voicing opinions.


Jim

[Ranger393]

Hi Ranger,

Welcome to our forum.

Be careful. This is a strange group. You've heard of "near the edge" or "over the edge". This group is OC about the edge. :p

sal

Thank you Sal and I hear you and will take your advice. I have lurked here for some time and really enjoy the forum so I joined. I am a vet of other knife forums so I do understand that as a newbie I shouldn't make my first post a shot across the bow of a long time member. I also know that internet forums are a breeding ground for egotistical cyber bullies. These days if a person has a positive outlook they, and their opinions, are dismissed as "fanboyism". If someone is critical, negative and combative then they are deep thinkers, smart and a realist. Sad but true.


Thanks again for the welcome!!!

[bluntcut]

Arm with a tiny of experience and a whole lot of hot air

IMO, Hap40 is an improved version of D2/K110/psf27. Cobalt prevent Cr and Mo carbide precipitation and coarsening in secondary temper temperature range(950F-1075F). This way, it's getting mostly lot of small Vanadium carbides instead, yield extra strength(peak ~1025F) and wear resistance w/o giving up much toughness.

otoh, D2 with great ht would be neck-to-neck hap40 good ht. Since Hap40 is a PM steel, edge stability & retention are heavily depend on MC sizes + ht, and then from that define the minimum threshold of blade+edge geometry per objective task. Anyone with spare bars of Hap40, gimme some and then I can tell you my hand-on experience with ht & using it. Also compare with my ain't too shabby unconventional D2 ht.

Keep in mind - higher carbon % -> higher carbide volume. and of course, type & size of carbide matter for edge stability & wear resistant. So even though D2 has high carbide volume than other 4 steels, however D2 CrC is far less wear resistant (in harsh abrasive uses) in comparison to others VC & WC.

[FCM415]

If they started offering 3Cr13, AEB-L, Sandviks and stopped offering the steels such as SxxV, 10v, M4 etc. perhaps attitudes would change? Since it doesn't seem to be happening and Spyderco is moving forward with these steels and similar, I guess we'll just have to live with getting called names and being labeled just because someone doesn't get what he wants.

If there was any hype, it surely did not come from Spyderco. It's the Delica/Endura/Stretch/Dfly fans that constantly ask for something new literally everyday on the forums. Even the FRN color choice had its own thread; started by a forum member mind you. There's your hype. I really find it ridiculous that some finds a fault in the logic of offering customers what they want. And as much as M4 is universally requested, it's good homework on their part for testing out a Japanese comparable. The maker is willing to work with only so many steels there, hey why not.

[sal]

Eating Ice cream is different from reading the ingredients.

sal

[Nasgul]

Eating Ice cream is different from reading the ingredients.

sal

:D
Love your answer !
You already said it differently, but it seems they did not get it. ^^

[Surfingringo]

mmmm...Ice Cream.

[harronek]

If this HAP40 is even vaguely similar to the M4 steel of my GB then I'm very happy to be a Crash test dummy and give it a try .
A Delica with M4 steel is what I drift off to sleep at night dreaming of , so " bring it on " .

Ken

[Ankerson]

mmmm...Ice Cream.

Mint Chocolate Chip. :cool:

[captnvegtble]

mmmm...Ice Cream.

Mint Chocolate Chip. :cool:

I just had some Black Raspberry Chocolate Chip today myself. Before that it was a tub of Mint Chocolate Chip.

[The Mastiff]

This was a strange thread.

Every now and then I still find myself surprised by people.

:)

Joe

Edit: BTW, I have some freeze dried mint chocolate chip ice cream. It's even good freeze dried.

[SuckSqueezeBangBlow]

So is the answer to the thread: yes, prone to chocolate chip?

[animportant]

Surprised that I received a bit of backlash because I asked if anyone was knowledgeable on HAP40 and could put down some (potentially unfounded) claims. Seems pretty childish to me.

[animportant]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... ARGxizxVcw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Hitachi's cold work steel .PDF file if anyone wants to take a look. Nothing wrong with trying to envision what kind of performance we will see based on composition and intent.

[bearfacedkiller]

If HAP40 is a step down from M4, could anyone recommend a commercially available Japanese steel that would be closer to M4? People have been asking Sal for quite some time to make runs of Japanese models in M4. Since M4 is not a Japanese steel, that's not going to happen. Perhaps HAP40 isn't the best possible chemical makeup alternative to M4 for a knife blade, but is there a better M4 replacement coming out of Japan that's available rolled in the appropriate thickness for a set of sprint runs?

I am not sure if it is readily available in sheets or not but this could be what your looking for.

http://www.zknives.com/knives/steels/st ... gm=0&hrn=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;