Ebay seller flipping Stepped Blue Titanium Chaparral's that he got for $19 each

[brian0918]

Illegal? No.

Immoral? Sure.

I let karma do it's thing.

Yeah, karma. What was the line? Having integrity is doing the right thing even when no one is watching.

Something like that.

Great quote and summarizes my view exactly!

[brian0918]

It looks like Blade Forums removed his post. Either that, or they blocked me.

[ABX2011]

I see the thread at Bladeforums.

[brian0918]

Ahh yep, they actually blocked me from the thread, deleted my posts, and gave me a warning. Here's what the admin had to say. Note their specific comments underlined.

You have received a warning at BladeForums.com.

Reason:
-------
Interfering with an Exchange thread

Do not post unnecessary comments in an Exchange thread.
Do not critique the seller or the item or the price.
If you aren't actually taking the knife, stay out.

-------

Bladeforums provides these Exchange forums for paid members. The seller owes no explanation for his pricing. Frankly, he should just post his prices and pictures and terms and leave it at that.

But he is under no obligation to conform to your moral outlook. The dealer is aware of his own error and can take it from there.

If you have evidence of a problem, Report Post is appropriate. Interfering with a sale is not.
-------

So they make moral exceptions for paid members. Nice to know!

And to clarify, the very first thing I did on that forum was click Report Post. But the mod is now pretending I didn't do that.

[Surfingringo]

Ahh yep, they actually blocked me from the thread, deleted my posts, and gave me a warning. Here's what the admin had to say. Note their specific comments underlined.

You have received a warning at BladeForums.com.

Reason:
-------
Interfering with an Exchange thread

Do not post unnecessary comments in an Exchange thread.
Do not critique the seller or the item or the price.
If you aren't actually taking the knife, stay out.

-------

Bladeforums provides these Exchange forums for paid members. The seller owes no explanation for his pricing. Frankly, he should just post his prices and pictures and terms and leave it at that.

But he is under no obligation to conform to your moral outlook. The dealer is aware of his own error and can take it from there.

If you have evidence of a problem, Report Post is appropriate. Interfering with a sale is not.
-------

So they make moral exceptions for paid members. Nice to know!

And to clarify, the very first thing I did on that forum was click Report Post. But the mod is now pretending I didn't do that.

You might want to take a break. Karma Police is exhausting work. Sit back and have a lemonade...read the funnies.

[bdblue]

I won't buy one from that guy. I think he is ethically challenged. His profiteering says a lot about him.

I don't think there is anything wrong with flipping knives. It is after all a free market economy, but this is wrong on so many levels.

I agree but if a person obtains an item legally and sells it for whatever price he is willing to take and someone is willing to give, there is not much else we can say about it. He has misrepresented his circumstances, which only matters if that allows him to take advantage of someone. Someone buying the knives should know what they are worth and if that is a good price or not. The bottom line is that the buyer probably is more interested in getting an authentic product, in the condition stated, than a sob story about whatever.

But yes I think the person is ethically challenged for making up a story to go along with the sale. All he has to do is say he has a knife for sale, he doesn't have to say why he has it or why he is selling it. Making up a story that isn't true reduces his credibility.

As for ethics among knife sellers, that time is long gone. I've been buying knives for a long time. There was a time when a custom knifemaker was selling his hand craftmanship and it was an honorable business with mostly ethical people. Now we are in the era of cutthroat buying and selling. I've seen too many examples of people buying a limited edition knife, receiving the package, and immediately listing it for significant profit. They make up a story as to why they are selling it, anything OTHER than saying that they are really selling it just for the profit. I don't want to deal with people like that if I don't have to. I will buy the knife from an honest dealer or I won't buy it at all.

Regarding that other forum- Almost all sellers remove the sales prices afterwards, in order to protect their pricing for the next sale and not allow history to set average price levels for certain knives. This is the only forum I know of that heavily promotes paid memberships. All of this is why I think knife selling is nothing but profit for most people.

[razorsharp]

They are his knives, and he can do what he so pleases. Even if it seems wrong. You're saying you wouldn't try to make money off a bargain you got..? I got offered a spyderco spyker for 130USD the other day (I missed the **** thing by a second) Should I have told him I was buying his knife to sell it for 230USD? I've course I wasn't going to because money speaks.

Now I'm far from greedy, in fact, I get more satisfaction out of giving but I will take a money making opportunity when I see one.

[brian0918]

I agree but if a person obtains an item legally and sells it for whatever price he is willing to take and someone is willing to give, there is not much else we can say about it.

What does the legality of someone's actions have to do with how one should judge his character. There are plenty of bad laws, and there are plenty of bad choices which should never be legally prohibited. For example, choosing to scoop up a bunch of Chaparral's from an unwitting dealer for a huge loss on their part.

[Philo Beddoe]

I suggested reporting the seller. Three clicks. I guess that's too much to ask. My bad.

You've been hitting the bong pipe to much if you think evilbay is going to do a single thing about this..as long as it generates a revenue stream for them they aren't going to do a dam thing..they allow fakes to be sold on their site all the time and IMO that's wayy worse..

As for this situation? Unehical? Yes, and this sucks for them but this mistake falls totally on E!cops shoulder..when you post anything on evilbay you HAVE to go back and check your listing every time..its not a option..its a must..

[twinboysdad]

You only have so many "mental dollars" to spend in a day...I would not spend mine on this. D bags gonna bag

[brian0918]

They are his knives, and he can do what he so pleases.

Who's arguing otherwise?

You're saying you wouldn't try to make money off a bargain you got..?

"Bargain" - you're using that word, I don't think it means what you think it means. A bargain is something that both parties knowingly understand to be an intended discount. This was a glitch, the seller did not intend it, or even know about it until it was too late.

I got offered a spyderco spyker for 130USD the other day (I missed the **** thing by a second) Should I have told him I was buying his knife to sell it for 230USD?

Apples and oranges. If he sold it to you for $20 would you think something was up? Of course you would. You're comparing one person saying his price to a computer having a glitch.

Now I'm far from greedy, in fact, I get more satisfaction out of giving but I will take a money making opportunity when I see one.

"Opportunity" - yet another word you're misusing. If a bank accidentally credits you a balance of $100,000, would you also consider that an "opportunity"?

[brian0918]

I suggested reporting the seller. Three clicks. I guess that's too much to ask. My bad.

You've been hitting the bong pipe to much if you think evilbay is going to do a single thing about this..as long as it generates a revenue stream for them they aren't going to do a dam thing..they allow fakes to be sold on their site all the time and IMO that's wayy worse..

Oh, I'm not kidding myself, but I have seen them remove listings before. Just not very frequently.

[Philo Beddoe]

Just sent him a offer for $19.21 :D Wonder if he'll take such a awesome deal?

[brian0918]

Did he accept your offer? It says they're sold. :mad:

[Philo Beddoe]

Nope he didn't accept. I guess .20 cents profit wasn't good enough..

[paladin]

Thanks for the intel brian... :)

Making a profit is one thing, but IMHO what that guy did is tantamount to stealing...

Not much difference from claiming that "I took the guy's wallet 'cause he left it unattended in his car seat with the window down, besides someone else would have gotten it if I didn't!"

Ecop! would never let those go for that if he had any recourse...

There is a price for doing business in America, but you shouldn't get ripped off doing it-- from the buyer side -OR- the seller side... :mad:

[Bodog]

Ahh yep, they actually blocked me from the thread, deleted my posts, and gave me a warning. Here's what the admin had to say. Note their specific comments underlined.

You have received a warning at BladeForums.com.

Reason:
-------
Interfering with an Exchange thread

Do not post unnecessary comments in an Exchange thread.
Do not critique the seller or the item or the price.
If you aren't actually taking the knife, stay out.

-------

Bladeforums provides these Exchange forums for paid members. The seller owes no explanation for his pricing. Frankly, he should just post his prices and pictures and terms and leave it at that.

But he is under no obligation to conform to your moral outlook. The dealer is aware of his own error and can take it from there.

If you have evidence of a problem, Report Post is appropriate. Interfering with a sale is not.
-------

So they make moral exceptions for paid members. Nice to know!

And to clarify, the very first thing I did on that forum was click Report Post. But the mod is now pretending I didn't do that.

But they ban people who speak positively about certain chinese made knives, they ban, or threaten to ban, people who speak negatively about certain companies who have reached the "cool" factor. It's business to them man. They obviously have a profit motive in what they do. There's no real fairness or rightness other than the amoral justice of profit in some manner. The best advice I can give is that no one really cares unless it happens to them and profit will trump morality and truth and fairness for most people. That's definitely true for almost every single business out there, including spyderco. Some are just more ethical than others, Spyderco being one of them. Let it go, that's a biased forum with some seriously arbitrary rules to follow. You aren't and won't ever be some knight in shining armor who can save the community from evil doers. The best you can do is to stay the **** out of threads you don't agree with and to stay away from the immoral suckers that are allowed to operate there. Accept that it's that way and move on. I had to learn the same stuff just not too long ago. If you don't like it and how they are, you're free to leave and associate with anyone else. They truly don't want to hear what fair is or not. They only want to hear from people who put free products in their pockets, money, knives, gear, or anything else. Suck it up, that's the real world. There's usually an agenda even if no one will say out loud what that agenda is. Live with it or move on. Your choice. I literally just had to deal with swallowing the same crap. I'm still on the fence with which way I want to go.

[PayneTrain]

I hear you brian, and I totally agree. In my opinion what he is doing is deplorable, especially making up a story about it in his ad. He's already on my "black list" of sellers for other reasons. Outside of the secondary market he's an ok guy from what I gather (I think he even holds an account here, though isn't active anymore), and I even remember seeing pics of him at the SFO, I believe with Sal. He's a little weird, but not sinister. He's a young guy, and we all do dumb things that we may be embarrassed about later in life...or maybe not. I don't think he's a criminal, just a young guy with judgement as "an area for improvement."

That being said, I don't think there is much anyone can do. I don't think he's breaking any laws, or even forum rules, much less ebay rules. Ebay is the next aliexpress, they just don't care as long as they get theirs. And it is, again as I understand it, their right to do so. I find it hard to believe some of the business some of these sites allow is legal, but I'm not even remotely a lawyer on any planet.

I appreciate you bringing this to my attention, whether or not it belongs on this forum. I don't like people taking advantage of others, and I don't believe in victimless crimes. It's not cool what he's doing, and if I were king he would be in a dungeon. Cuz I would still have dungeons.

Edit: What he IS doing wrong is violating paypal's terms of service, another thing BF is totally ok with. I love the big red notice at the top of CPF, hats off to them for taking a stance. Maybe you can get him with paypal? I really don't know. Anyways, I think I've left enough muddy footprints for now.

[razorsharp]

yet another word you're misusing. If a bank accidentally credits you a balance of $100,000, would you also consider that an "opportunity"?

No thats illegal- thats the difference

[TheRaven]

If I hadn't brought this up, nobody would have known. I guess I'm the karma you've all heard about. :D

I agree with you Brian. Glad you brought it up.

Also, there are a few people here completely contradicting themselves. I'm shaking more my head.