I'm having a little trouble with 1095, is it normal?

[Donut]

So, I have a knife and it became somewhat dull. I have trouble sharpening wharncliff blades... sometimes.

What has been happening lately is this: I sharpen it, and I can get it to cut paper, but after I cut maybe 10 inches or so of paper... I can't saw through it without tearing it. It is dull.

Does 1095 have this bad of wear resistance, or is it something to do with my sharpening? By the way, I'm finishing with alternating strokes, then very light alternating strokes on the sharpmaker. I tried stropping after it initially got dull and it cut a little bit, then became what seems like dull again.

Please give me some advice or tell me if you have the same experience or different experience with 1095.

[yablanowitz]

I don't know what kind of knife you have, but that is not typical of 1095 specifically. It sounds to me like you have a very thin burr that is folding over when you start cutting. It will feel very sharp, and it will be, but it isn't very durable. I'd take a couple of light strokes edge down on the stone to clean it off, then sharpen it again using VERY light alternating strokes. Remember, you aren't dealing with high carbide volumes here. It isn't like sharpening S110V or ZDP-189. The corners of the rods will eat it up fast, so you might want to skip straight to the flats

[chuck_roxas45]

You have high wear resistance paper. :D

[Donut]

LOL. I'll try to resharpen it and see how it does.

[xceptnl]

I don't know what kind of knife you have, but that is not typical of 1095 specifically. It sounds to me like you have a very thin burr that is folding over when you start cutting. It will feel very sharp, and it will be, but it isn't very durable. I'd take a couple of light strokes edge down on the stone to clean it off, then sharpen it again using VERY light alternating strokes. Remember, you aren't dealing with high carbide volumes here. It isn't like sharpening S110V or ZDP-189. The corners of the rods will eat it up fast, so you might want to skip straight to the flats

I agree with this. I have noticed my GECs with 1095 take a much lighter stroke on the benchstones than most of my other knives. In this, I have been "de-stressing" the edge by drawing across the stone to completely dull it before I sharpen. Are you using the factory edge angles (pretty steep) or have you lowered the angles?

[Monocrom]

Honestly, having trouble resharpening 1095 often means the knife itself was probably poorly heat-treated.

[Donut]

I've tried a few different angles. 40 degrees, 30 degrees, narrower than 30 degrees.

I'll destress the edge and give it another few tries.

[tlo14290]

Yeah, you may be getting a little burr. I have a large TOPS knife ( the Armageddon ) in 1095 which holds an edge really well, you can chop wood with it and still shave arm hair. I did notice that it takes a light touch on the stone, but it takes a lot less effort to sharpen than S30V, for instance. The previous comments about the heat treatment sound reasonable, or the very edge may have been cooked when it was sharpened at the factory, this is very common across the board with many mfg and steels. Cutting the apex off ( destressing ) should fix that.

Good luck!

[.357 mag]

Spend more time with the coarse stone before you move to the next. Make sure any burr is gone before you move to the next grit.

[The Mastiff]

I agree with the burr theory. Some knives can hang on to burrs. I have a Boker lockback with a beautiful design and nice Bubinga covers but it burrs something terrible. First one side, then another. then another, and another.

I've sharpened for over 40 years and my technique isn't that bad. Some knives( cars, hammers, mothers in law, etc.) just don't agree with a person for one reason or another.

joe

[jackknifeh]

I agree with the burr theory also. If you have a burr, even ones that are hard to detect, they can snap off when cutting leaving the edge cutting poorly. What knife company is the knife from and is it a reputable one who you can trust the heat treat? Some companies get other companies to heat treat their blades I think. I think the burr is probably the most likely problem. I'm going from other peoples testing and the results posted. But if you can get the edge bevels meeting at the apex with no burrs you should get good edge retention.

On the final strokes go very slow using as light amount of pressure as you can. The last strokes to remove any very tiny burrs need to be very light so you don't create a burr on the other side. 1095 isn't a hard steel so while easy to sharpen compared to ZDP and others it may be easier to create burrs when using too much pressure. The only experience I have with 1095 is a GEC and a ESEE IZULA II. Both hold an edge well for one of the softer steels. I think the Rc is 56-58 or something like that. Not 100% sure about that and it might differ depending on the companies specs.

[defenestrate]

Agreed with jackknifeh, most of the field knives and milspec blades are not run especially hard - 1095 can get fairly hard, and I think I've seen a differential treat done with it but it can get brittle and chippy once you get up into the 60s. Even the harder blades are usually fairly easy to sharpen, so I would lean toward a burr being the culprit.

[Cliff Stamp]

Does 1095 have this bad of wear resistance....

Mild steel doesn't have that low a wear resistance to have paper wear the edge off in 10", nor is it that weak in general that the edge would deform/fracture so readily.

The apex is folding because it is formed in such a way which leaves it extremely weak and/or fragile, it isn't anything to do with the angle, or grit, as they can't produce that strong of an effect.

It is most likely a combination of the steel at the apex being severely strained, and the apex being formed by deformation vs abrasion, and/or being over ground.

This apex will fold over almost immediately and go dull :



This can cut ~1 km of cardboard and still slice a tomato :



Same steel, same stone.

The first apex was produced on steel which was highly strained from significant use which can leave the metal in a high state of fatigue. It is prone to excessive burr formation and premature collapse in use.

-cut the apex off
-form the apex, ideally with a muddy stone, don't burr sharpen
-micro-bevel alternating passes, use short strokes, ultra-light force and cross scratch patterns

If a burr forms, cut it off at double the sharpening angle and back sharpen if desired.

[Donut]

I think I did too many passes to flatten my edge. I spent about 20 minutes trying to apex and I can still see light reflecting of the end of my edge.

I plan on doing some work on it tonight, we'll see if I can get the edge to apex.

[jackknifeh]

I think I did too many passes to flatten my edge. I spent about 20 minutes trying to apex and I can still see light reflecting of the end of my edge.

I plan on doing some work on it tonight, we'll see if I can get the edge to apex.

You might try raising the angle just so you get the bevels to meet. Once you have a sharp apex, then work on thinning the blade behind the edge or lowering the angle of the bevels. In my thinking I like to get the apex formed then work on the edge above the apex (bevels) if they need it. That's how I look at it but I'm sure others have their own thinking.

Jack

[Donut]

I went to a Coarse DMT stone and it apexed pretty quickly.

I'm in progress of testing the edge, but it seems to be doing better.

[Monocrom]

Just curious.... How has the edge been holding up these past few days?

[Donut]

It's going pretty good. It's still cutting very nice.

I'm tempted to reset the edge on a few of my other knives that I'm having trouble with them staying sharp. Does anyone know how many times you should run an edge onto a stone? Is one time enough? Twice?

[Cliff Stamp]

...how many times you should run an edge onto a stone? Is one time enough? Twice?

The amount of material you need to remove is just enough so that when it is sharpened the apex forms on undamaged steel. The problem is that statement, while true, doesn't really help because how to you know how much material you have to remove to make that happen.

All I can say is just pay attention to how many times you cut the knife into the stone and how the knife responds. The goal is to find the minimum amount, just don't stress over it either way as just doing it at all makes much more of a difference than exactly how much you do.

It is like considering switching from eating raw white sugar to fruits and then thinking about eating apples or oranges. While there are different nutritional profiles and given certain activities and other food intakes then it might me more/less optimal to eat an apple or orange it is a small effect compared to just eating either of them vs the caloric intake of white sugar.

[Donut]

Thanks Cliff, I'll work on eating apples while figuring out how many passes, then eating oranges while figuring out how many passes.

Then I'll report back. :)