Title change:Not impressed with Spyderco Delica 4

[FCM415]

Cliff is right.

[Cliff Stamp]

[...]
How many members have felt like their first hand experience is invalid because YOU said so?

Your experience is a valid representation of your experience obviously, it is what you have observed. However, when you assert conclusions beyond that and argue justification based on your experience and you ignore methodology which is known to be necessary to allow experience to generate knowledge - well your conclusions are not justified. In most cases, the people who complain about this will do the exact same thing, make the exact same argument, to oppose someone else when they are arguing a different viewpoint.

[Knutty]

I thought the replies were quite respectful. Try going onto some other forum and complain about an Emerson knife... I'd be surprised if you didn't get multiple death threats within 15 minutes.

I am a bit surprised that Sal referred to a customer as fecal matter, though (unless I've simply misconstrued).

If I'm dealing with a buttnugget, I usually just tell them to go away.

[FCM415]

^
Made me :eek: But I think the key is "If" he was dealing with a butt nugget. LMAO

[3rdGenRigger]

He didn't imply that he was, and as such wasn't referring to the OP, but to other customers that he himself described as irate and abusive toward his employees...which I think is entirely justified.

[Knutty]

He didn't imply that he was, and as such wasn't referring to the OP, but to other customers that he himself described as irate and abusive toward his employees...which I think is entirely justified.

I'm pretty good with English grammar, and I disagree. Not that I disagree with Sal though. :)

I think you should apologize to your fellow forumites and maybe even to Charlynn. Getting on a forum when you're pissed is never a good idea. In fact when I'm pissed, I just shut my mouth until I am no longer pissed and can begin to be rational.

[sal]

Sorry if I gave the impression that I was referring to the OP as fecal matter. Not so. I tried to say that I'm not very patient with fecal matter posters.

sal

[Blerv]

Not to rub salt in the OP's wound but what I don't get, in general, is the genuine outrage and confusion that occurs when a product fails.

The best products in the world have an inherent failure rate, it's just lower than the worst products in the world. The better side of the spectrum, besides having higher initial quality and long-term reliability, also has in general better W&R teams that work to "make things right". This is assuming the failure wasn't user-caused.

Of companies that produce products with multiple moving-parts, per dollar, Spyderco has to be one of the top companies out there. A Delica4 is a fairly complicated tool that is not fully built/assembled by automatons. The finishing and fitment takes an artisan. It's MSRP is also quite low for the average lifespan it should give to the user; it's the price of a marginal pair of tennis shoes and we know how long those last.

In general the purchase/use/warranty system is the same. You do research and buy reputable products (from reputable dealers) with quality warranties to minimize your chance of problems and maximize the chance if they occur the company will be great to deal with. If you have a problem, a gentle tone and organized arrangement of information will get you faster and more reliable results. It's still possible thanks to statistics to come up with a very unlucky dice roll...just like it's possible to get hit in the head by a lightning-charged coconut.

If the company says you had lint in your knife, either you believe them based on their stellar reputation (see above) or you assume they are attempting to gouge you. If the latter, either you are on to a real conspiracy or going down an angry trail of paranoid delusion. Before you come to a conclusion on that though, I would check Amazon.com's reviews on the Delica4 :).

[Philo Beddoe]

Why is my Delica getting lint in it?

[ChrisinHove]

I'm getting the hang of these threads now...
1. OP says specific knife or customer services is rubbish, because their knife has a) rusted b) jammed c) gone blunt or d) lost/buggered screws
2. Forum takes mild offence and points out that these do or may relate to operator error
3. Cliff points out that the OP may not be wrong
4. Some incredulity is posted
5. We await further news following inspection of the item by Spyderco
6. Nothing is ever heard of again of the OP or defect.

Is there any merit in the idea of the Edge-u-cation leaflet directing new owners to a subsection of this Forum specifically for perhaps less experienced owners to post queries/gripes and obtain advice? There's a wealth of knowledge and experience here (myself excluded!).

[The Mastiff]

I'm getting the hang of these threads now...

:)

Seems to describe I'd guess 97 or so percent of those type posts. Sal has often gone out of the way to not embarrass posters who aren't willing or able to admit being wrong in their initial assessment. They will disappear after going through with all sorts of nonsense they wrote while angry. Then, after their prideful, defensive responses to us forumites it's usually to be not seen again unless it's a few weeks later and under a different login. :)

I have met many people in this world that have some sort of inability to admit being wrong. A character defect the way I see it. I was going to call it pathological but decided against it. It's often part of the whole victim complex our culture offers people to use instead of the personal growth that can come with learning instead of blaming when failures occur.

Joe

[The Deacon]

1. OP says specific knife or customer services is rubbish, because their knife has a) rusted b) jammed c) gone blunt or d) lost/buggered screws
2. Forum takes mild offence and points out that these do or may relate to operator error
3. Cliff points out that the OP may not be wrong

Or, more often:

3. Cliff pontificates on the wrongheadedness of the majority of members here. Sometimes, as is the case here, waiting to post his condemnation of our actions until after the OP has had a chance to cool down and edit his post to remove the most inflammatory language.

Here's how I see it:

A fellow walks into a crowded bar that he's never visited before. More specifically, a crowded sports bar. More specifically yet, a crowded sports bar that's located in "Team X's" home town, owned by a retired player, painted in the team colors, and decorated with autographed photos and other memorabilia of its past and present players.

Now, if the first thing that fellow does is to yell out something negative about the team, or one of its star players, in a loud voice, what kind of a welcome do you think he'll get? It's one of those "even if you're right, you're wrong" moments.

Granted, the analogy isn't perfect, but why anyone would waltz into any "room", be it physical or cyber, which is obviously a gathering place for fans of something or someone, bad-mouth the object of their respect, and expect to be welcomed with open arms, is beyond me. ****, there are "real world" rooms where doing so would imply a death wish, or at least extreme case of masochism.

Funny how that works.

[xinam]

Bottom line: The OP didn't know any better. OP was mad. we've all been there....
I'm guessing that OP is well informed now. He has a sharpened/cleaned delica in route to his house, with a little luck and edge-ucation maybe his opinion of the company will change. Maybe if we leave this alone Suv44 will be back, and contribute to this forum, thats why we are here right??? You can't write a guy off for getting mad and having the guts to step into the lions den and say something about it... Lets go somewhere else and talk about knives for a while. Bashing OP and the lint thing have been well covered :)

[tvenuto]

Haha actually deacon your analogy is pretty close. The only part you left out is where the "black sheep" (if we can call him that without implying right/wrong) then leaves the room and the fans continue to make their case as though he was still there, until such time that the cases have gotten so detailed that the fans begin to argue the nuances of their point with each other and the black sheep is totally forgotten in favor of these new arguments.

[akaAK]

Why is my Delica getting lint in it?

Based on Evid D's self reported OCD I think you just gave him a heart attack.

In the grand scheme of things I thought this whole discussion was pretty tame.

[Ankerson]

I keep hearing that lint is a possibility. How many here have bought a new knife,carried it in there pocket for a few months, took it out and operated it to make sure it's ok. When the time came to use it, it failed you? I believe this is rare.You would be pissed too.

I would say likely more than a few as some of us have been around for a very long time.

Personally I have been carrying knives for over 40 years and yes lint can and will be an issue if it's not removed, mostly in slip joints and lock backs.

So it's a good thing to check and remove if needed to maintain the lock making sure it's working correctly.

Tell tail sign would be you don't hear that snap when you open the blade, the lint will buffer the sound so it won't be as loud as it usually is so it needs to be removed.

That's if you like your fingers, if the lock fails you could lose them so it's a good idea to make sure it's clean and free of lint or other grit etc.

[SpyderNut]

I'm getting the hang of these threads now...

...I have met many people in this world that have some sort of inability to admit being wrong. A character defect the way I see it. I was going to call it pathological but decided against it. It's often part of the whole victim complex our culture offers people to use instead of the personal growth that can come with learning instead of blaming when failures occur.

Joe

Well said, Joe. You hit the nail on the head.

I don't have a horse in this race, but I will say that pocket lint poses a real problem for most pocket knives that are carried loosely in the pocket. For instance, my brother-in-law recently gave me his knife to inspect because it "didn't open correctly" for some reason. (The knife was a decent quality Kershaw with an assisted opening mechanism). After inspecting said knife, I saw a bit of gunk and fuzz sticking out of the tang/lock-up area. Fifiteen minutes later after a little elbow grease and oil, the knife opened and locked up lIke new. I sharpened it and gave it back to him with the warning to make sure and check for lint. Seems simple enough, but this issue can creep up on any knife if the user doesn't pay attention.

[JNewell]

I keep hearing that lint is a possibility. How many here have bought a new knife,carried it in there pocket for a few months, took it out and operated it to make sure it's ok. When the time came to use it, it failed you? I believe this is rare.You would be pissed too.

I would say likely more than a few as some of us have been around for a very long time.

Personally I have been carrying knives for over 40 years and yes lint can and will be an issue if it's not removed, mostly in slip joints and lock backs.

So it's a good thing to check and remove if needed to maintain the lock making sure it's working correctly.

Tell tail sign would be you don't hear that snap when you open the blade, the lint will buffer the sound so it won't be as loud as it usually is so it needs to be removed.

That's if you like your fingers, if the lock fails you could lose them so it's a good idea to make sure it's clean and free of lint or other grit etc.

Wait, wait, are you suggesting that someone who uses a very sharp tool needs to take any responsibility for using it carefully and maintaining it? :rolleyes: That's just plain outrageous. :p

[FCM415]

I'm an idiot.

[suv44]

In due time I will respond when I am ready. I have a lot more to say.