Sharpmaker and reprofiling a chef's knife

[ZMW]

I have my CBN rods and standard sharpmaker rods and was working on a cutco chef's knife that was fairly dull. I found that using the flats was very effective with reprofiling (30d) but even with the CBN rods it was taking me a long time. I gave up after 30 min and the knife was reasonably sharp, but definitely not ideal.

I was taking off tons of metal and I can visibly see the bevels changing, but again, the timeframe was a little rough.

Even with a 440 variation steel on a chef's knife, should it take 30-60 minutes to reprofile that sucker? Any thoughts? (no sharpie trick is needed, I can see the regrinding marks. Going slower seemed to work better for me, and I got into a rhythm on the flats, but I ran outta time/patience)

Thanks!

[farnorthdan]

Depending on how dull, sure it can take a long time, I love my Sharpmaker but when it comes to re-profiling I almost always go to my Edge Pro with some seriously course stone so I can make short work out of removing some steel. I do end up back to the SM for maintaining that new edge though. :)

[Water Bug]

I sharpen my mother and brother's kitchen knives, and sometimes their knives are quite dull when I work on them. Even with the Spyderco Tri-Angle Diamond Stones on my Spyderco Tr-Angle Sharpmaker, I find it can sometimes take me a good LONG while to get something in the way of an edge started on their knives before I can move on to the Spyderco Brown then White Tri-Angle Stones. I've found the difficulty in overcoming the dullness of on their knives to be a combination of how dull the knives are, the quality of the knives, and the steel they're made of. One of my brother's kitchen knives is a better quality brand with a better quality steel and even when it's really dull, I can usually bring the edge back realtively quickly on the Diamond Stones.

I sharpened one of my mother's kitchen knives recently... it was so dull that, after several minutes of no success using my Diamond Stones in the standard 40 degree configuration, I eventually removed the stones and guards, replaced the cover, and flipped the my Sharpmaker over and used the two long slots on the bottom to combine my two Diamond Stones into a "bench stone"... I then freehand sharpened the knife at a near flat angle to finally get an edge started. I then reconfigured my Sharpmaker with the Brown Stones, then the White Stones, inserted in the standard 40 degree positions to finish the edge. Took me quite a while, and it took a lot of patience, but I got the job done. I'm sure others more skilled in knife sharpening could've gotten the job done faster on the Sharpmaker, but at least I have the satisfaction of knowing that I was able to do it.

Hope this helps.

[ZMW]

Good to know its normal to take that long. I will give it another go here soon. Thanks

[Evil D]

Something to consider is holding the blade at 90 degrees. It's far more important that you're hitting the stone at the right angle than the speed at which you're making passes if you get sloppy and start hitting the stone the wrong way you can easily round off the edge you're making and not realize it.

[Jazz]

I sharpen my chef knives freehand on bench stones. You can put a lot more pressure on them that way for reprofiling, for the really dull ones. Everyone says go light, but they must have all day to fool around sharpening. I go hard, then light on the finer stones after I have an edge.

[paladin]

Depending on how dull, sure it can take a long time, I love my Sharpmaker but when it comes to re-profiling I almost always go to my Edge Pro with some seriously course stone so I can make short work out of removing some steel. I do end up back to the SM for maintaining that new edge though. :)

Textbook answer, and IMHO, the BEST way to employ the SharpMaker <better name = SharpKEEPER or SharpMAINTAINER>

I sharpen my chef knives freehand on bench stones. You can put a lot more pressure on them that way for reprofiling, for the really dull ones. Everyone says go light, but they must have all day to fool around sharpening. I go hard, then light on the finer stones after I have an edge.

I've had good luck this way also, especially when you use the "Japanese" method of grinding your edge.

[bh49]

Depending on how dull, sure it can take a long time, I love my Sharpmaker but when it comes to re-profiling I almost always go to my Edge Pro with some seriously course stone so I can make short work out of removing some steel. I do end up back to the SM for maintaining that new edge though. :)

+1
Also it depends on how thick original edge was. I doubt that Catco was even close to 30 degrees originally.
+1
To what Paladin said

[Johnnie1801]

Which angle setting are you using? For kitchen knives you're probably best off using the 40 degree setting.

[ZMW]

Depending on how dull, sure it can take a long time, I love my Sharpmaker but when it comes to re-profiling I almost always go to my Edge Pro with some seriously course stone so I can make short work out of removing some steel. I do end up back to the SM for maintaining that new edge though. :)

+1
Also it depends on how thick original edge was. I doubt that Catco was even close to 30 degrees originally.
+1
To what Paladin said

The original edge seems no where close to 30 degrees, so I was cutting a lot of metal off...

"Which angle setting are you using? For kitchen knives you're probably best off using the 40 degree setting."

I was using 30 degrees. I read that high angle is best for kitchen knives

[bh49]

I am reprofiling at 30, then microbevel at 40. But I am using WE for reprofiling. Also I do not have cutco. All my kitchen knives are Japanese made and most of them came with thin edge.

[SG89]

I sharpen my chef knives freehand on bench stones. You can put a lot more pressure on them that way for reprofiling, for the really dull ones. Everyone says go light, but they must have all day to fool around sharpening. I go hard, then light on the finer stones after I have an edge.

Which bench stones do you recommend?

[bearfacedkiller]

You can reprofile with the sharpmaker. I have taken Bowies with 12 inch blades down from 40 to 30 degrees with mine and the diamond rods.

People always want to ask how long it takes to sharpen and there simply is no way to answer that. How dull did you let it get? Are there chips or other damage that needs removing? How thick is the edge and what angle is the edge at? How worn are your rods? How many strokes per minute can you do while maintaining a very consistent stroke? How hard do you press? How often do you clean your stones? What steel is it and what is the heat treat like? There are just too many variables at play for us to say how long. The truth is that if you haven't sharpened it in a very long time that it will then take you a long time to get it sharp.

My advice is to get a rocks glass, pour three fingers of your preferred whiskey (for steadying of the hand as well as improved patience) and to get back to it. Get it sharp this time and then just don't forget how much work it is to sharpen a dull knife compared to how easy it is to touch up a not quite sharp knife. Then, from that point on just break out your sharpmaker once a week and give her a 5 minute or less touch up. That's how I roll.

I will also suggest that you run a 30/40 setup with a microbevel. It makes everything so much easier. Also, don't write off the sharpie. It can be hard to tell if you are actually near the edge when you get closer. If you don't use a sharpie then I suggest raising a bur down both sides to ensure that you have apexed. I would rather use a sharpie and a loupe than to raise a bur however I do sharpen both ways.

I have a bunch of bench stones but I still need a extra coarse stone. If a friend, relative or coworker asks me to sharpen a knife that clearly has never been sharpened that needs significant reprofiling or repair I will sometimes tape a piece of 200 grit sandpaper to a piece of 3" x 12" piece of flat steel plate to make an improvised stone. I have even just taped sandpaper flat to a kitchen counter at a friends house who had no stones to sharpen. You can certainly do some easy reprofiling with coarse sandpaper. If I am at someone's house and they have some 200 grit sandpaper and some duct tape I can go out to my truck and grab my double stuff pocket stone and have someone's jacked up kitchen knife up and running in no time at all.

[ZMW]

Good stuff BFK, I dig it!

[bearfacedkiller]

Cool, I hope I helped. :)

[Jazz]

Which angle setting are you using? For kitchen knives you're probably best off using the 40 degree setting.

Really? And you can cut stuff with that? Not being a smartass - serious question. Should be at least 15° per side for efficient chef knife cutting. Steel it often and it's fine.

[Jazz]

I sharpen my chef knives freehand on bench stones. You can put a lot more pressure on them that way for reprofiling, for the really dull ones. Everyone says go light, but they must have all day to fool around sharpening. I go hard, then light on the finer stones after I have an edge.

Which bench stones do you recommend?

Any good coarse and medium or fine. I use a Norton double sided one that no blade steel has stumped yet.

[Bloke]

Which bench stones do you recommend?

The stones I like best are the Naniwa Chosera's. :cool:

They're a synthetic water stone and as such are a little messy but bliss to use. They come with a Nagura which is a seperate stone you can use to make a light slurry, condition the chosera and also flatten it to a certain extent.

My experience is they remove metal pretty fast and hold up well. Scandinavian grind bush knives and such on a 400grit Chosera can be mesmerising. The sound of stone cutting steel is near musical and leaves a clean edge with matte grey finish you could easily polish if you wish. :)

[Jazz]

Can the rods be layed flat side by side on the Shatpmaker stand? If so, there you go. Perfect.

[Johnnie1801]

Which angle setting are you using? For kitchen knives you're probably best off using the 40 degree setting.

Really? And you can cut stuff with that? Not being a smartass - serious question. Should be at least 15° per side for efficient chef knife cutting. Steel it often and it's fine.

Kitchen knives usually aren't hard enough to cope with acute angles, they tend to be thinner stock and softer steels so the edge gets damaged much faster. 20 degrees per side gives you an edge that'll last longer. I think Sal explained it in the Sharpmaker video (I need to watch that again sometime). I don't have any Japanese knives but I think they can be run more acute as they use better steels like vg-10. Japanese steels can be ground thin, maintaining flexibility and still be hard enough for a thinner edge. I use the 40 degree setting with the Sharpmaker on my kitchen knives and they're shaving sharp and perform well.