flipper that doesn't flip so well (Southard)

[mattman]

Little bit on the detent, too (avoid getting lube on the lock face)

[sbaker345]

Little bit on the detent, too (avoid getting lube on the lock face)

Honestly, I wouldn't freak out about lube on the lockface, I'll bet money a lot of knives leave the factory with oil on the lockface either intentionally or not.

[dubya3]

Is it gritty when you open it or its not not easy to flip?

Not gritty at all. I just got home and I'm planning on putting a drop of oil on the bearings to see what that does, after I get done playing with the new Manix S110V I just got in the mail!

Sounds like its mostly skill related, combined perhaps with a touch too tight pivot, if the pivot was cranked down it would feel gritty or like it was grinding. It takes a while to learn to flip a specific knife, combined with the knife breaking in.

I loosened the pivot a tad and it's a bit easier now. It's been getting better all day and I'm guessing it's my technique is getting better although I do think this model just isn't and "flippy" as I expected and there's no way around it. Like mentioned above, it's the mass of the blade (lighter than the other flipper I have) and just getting used to it in general. It's flipping good, just not real fast and it doesn't lock open every single time which is where I want to be at with this knife.

[mattman]

If the detent is dry, you'll be suprised how much it effects the action.

[mattman]

Little bit on the detent, too (avoid getting lube on the lock face)

Honestly, I wouldn't freak out about lube on the lockface, I'll bet money a lot of knives leave the factory with oil on the lockface either intentionally or not.

It has been known to cause drama on Ti locks.

[JNewell]

My Brown Southard just never really flipped that well.
The Black Southard is awesome.....
But they are both a push button technique imo

Mine doesn't flip for beans. I've tried loosening the pivot, cleaning it out thoroughly, lubing with very light grease, lubing with various oils - this one simply doesn't flip. One of my sons has one that he bought at the same time and it's night and day between the two. His flips very well. I think I got a rare case of poor QC from Taiching. I should have sent it in but never got around to it and it's not clear that Spyderco would be interested in warranty service at this point.

[MacLaren]

My Brown Southard just never really flipped that well.
The Black Southard is awesome.....
But they are both a push button technique imo

Mine doesn't flip for beans. I've tried loosening the pivot, cleaning it out thoroughly, lubing with very light grease, lubing with various oils - this one simply doesn't flip. One of my sons has one that he bought at the same time and it's night and day between the two. His flips very well. I think I got a rare case of poor QC from Taiching. I should have sent it in but never got around to it and it's not clear that Spyderco would be interested in warranty service at this point.

Ive had more than 1 Brown Southard, and really none of em flipped that well to be honest. But that Black one sure does. Dont get me wrong, if ya pre load it does fine. You just have to make sure to pre load. The Black one flips rrally easy and nice.

[dubya3]

I wonder if the black blade is a little smoother, self lubricating type deal. The more I play with mine the more I love it but the not so awesome flipping action will always bug me until it smooths out.

Are any of the other spydie flippers kind of like the Southard as far as not being super smooth always? I've always wanted a Rubicon but the 3" blade had held me back (for some reason I rarely like a 3" folder, I'm not even sure why!) and like the Positron but again, it's in that blade length range I don't care for.

The Manix 2 flipper I've been hearing about is jackpot to me, I really think I'd be satisfied with a heavy blade with a flipper, like the XL. It's one of my vvery favorite models too. Fingers crossed

[Cujobob]

If it doesn't flip well I would likely recommend taking it apart and cleaning various surfaces and then lubing it up and putting it back together. The only issue with the southard as a flipper from what I could tell was the extreme lock bar tension is a bit of an issue, though nothing too major.

[elena86]

If it doesn't flip well I would likely recommend taking it apart and cleaning various surfaces and then lubing it up and putting it back together. The only issue with the southard as a flipper from what I could tell was the extreme lock bar tension is a bit of an issue, though nothing too major.

I did that from day one and mine flips like a champ :cool: It's a great design.

[palonej]

Hey Cory.
Couple guys on BF had the same exact flipping issue as you.
They sent them back to Golden and they are now flipping dreams!
Send it back bro! Carried the black Southard all weekend and had a flipping blast with it!

[Surfingringo]

Is it gritty when you open it or its not not easy to flip?

Not gritty at all. I just got home and I'm planning on putting a drop of oil on the bearings to see what that does, after I get done playing with the new Manix S110V I just got in the mail!

Sounds like its mostly skill related, combined perhaps with a touch too tight pivot, if the pivot was cranked down it would feel gritty or like it was grinding. It takes a while to learn to flip a specific knife, combined with the knife breaking in.

I loosened the pivot a tad and it's a bit easier now. It's been getting better all day and I'm guessing it's my technique is getting better although I do think this model just isn't and "flippy" as I expected and there's no way around it. Like mentioned above, it's the mass of the blade (lighter than the other flipper I have) and just getting used to it in general. It's flipping good, just not real fast and it doesn't lock open every single time which is where I want to be at with this knife.

Hey dubya, I don't know what the reasons might be but I had the same experience with the few Southards I handled. Honestly, I have never been impressed with any flipper until I got the recent custom from Gayle Bradley. I don't really know exactly what he did engineering/physics wise to that design but it is really incredible in its function. FWIW, the blade on that knife is very thinly ground and quite light and it still flips open effortlessly. I think blade mass is only important to compensate for something else that isn't just right in the action. It is interesting that some others have Southards that flip beautifully. That leads me to believe that it is not a physics issue with the design. Could it be a result of too much lockbar tension?? I dunno.

[palonej]

I'd have to agree Lance. I'd love to know what was done to the ones that were sent back, but both guys said performance is night and day afterwards.
Also, I'm one of the black Southard owners, in my hand right now, it's very hard NOT to flip it.....if you know what I mean.
I have a Brous Bionic that was doing what Cory describes.....limp flick....it seems the prob is the detent.....I sent it back.

[HarleyXJGuy]

Is it gritty when you open it or its not not easy to flip?

Not gritty at all. I just got home and I'm planning on putting a drop of oil on the bearings to see what that does, after I get done playing with the new Manix S110V I just got in the mail!

Sounds like its mostly skill related, combined perhaps with a touch too tight pivot, if the pivot was cranked down it would feel gritty or like it was grinding. It takes a while to learn to flip a specific knife, combined with the knife breaking in.

I loosened the pivot a tad and it's a bit easier now. It's been getting better all day and I'm guessing it's my technique is getting better although I do think this model just isn't and "flippy" as I expected and there's no way around it. Like mentioned above, it's the mass of the blade (lighter than the other flipper I have) and just getting used to it in general. It's flipping good, just not real fast and it doesn't lock open every single time which is where I want to be at with this knife.

Hey dubya, I don't know what the reasons might be but I had the same experience with the few Southards I handled. Honestly, I have never been impressed with any flipper until I got the recent custom from Gayle Bradley. I don't really know exactly what he did engineering/physics wise to that design but it is really incredible in its function. FWIW, the blade on that knife is very thinly ground and quite light and it still flips open effortlessly. I think blade mass is only important to compensate for something else that isn't just right in the action. It is interesting that some others have Southards that flip beautifully. That leads me to believe that it is not a physics issue with the design. Could it be a result of too much lockbar tension?? I dunno.

Custom GB? Do tell.

I just got me a Southard and it was very hard to flip for the first couple of days. As soon as my Sketchen scale gets here I will oil and mess with the pivot to see if it helps.

It has gotten better the more I flipped it but not great. Seems the detent is very strong.

[dubya3]

Is it gritty when you open it or its not not easy to flip?

Not gritty at all. I just got home and I'm planning on putting a drop of oil on the bearings to see what that does, after I get done playing with the new Manix S110V I just got in the mail!

Sounds like its mostly skill related, combined perhaps with a touch too tight pivot, if the pivot was cranked down it would feel gritty or like it was grinding. It takes a while to learn to flip a specific knife, combined with the knife breaking in.

I loosened the pivot a tad and it's a bit easier now. It's been getting better all day and I'm guessing it's my technique is getting better although I do think this model just isn't and "flippy" as I expected and there's no way around it. Like mentioned above, it's the mass of the blade (lighter than the other flipper I have) and just getting used to it in general. It's flipping good, just not real fast and it doesn't lock open every single time which is where I want to be at with this knife.

Hey dubya, I don't know what the reasons might be but I had the same experience with the few Southards I handled. Honestly, I have never been impressed with any flipper until I got the recent custom from Gayle Bradley. I don't really know exactly what he did engineering/physics wise to that design but it is really incredible in its function. FWIW, the blade on that knife is very thinly ground and quite light and it still flips open effortlessly. I think blade mass is only important to compensate for something else that isn't just right in the action. It is interesting that some others have Southards that flip beautifully. That leads me to believe that it is not a physics issue with the design. Could it be a result of too much lockbar tension?? I dunno.

Hey Lance! I have read reports of people sending their Southard back to SFO for lousy flipping and they claim it's a 180° on the action. I haven't fully disassembled mine and put a drop oil on the bearing system yet but I may do so tonight. I did take the G10 scale off and clean/lube it a bit. The action is MUCH smoother now than when I received it last week, it flips open with authority as long as gravity is helping the blade a bit but if the orientation is such that the blade is flipping up, it's still not that smooth feeling.

You could be right about the lockbar tension, that crossed my mind last week but that's not something I'd even think about messing with! The lockup is early and not sticky at all so im not positive a too strong bar is the issue with this particular piece.

Off topic a bit here but isn't the G10G10 texture on the Southard absolutely amazing!? I love the peel ply texture that's normally used but I'd love to have the rougher texture on the others.

[dubya3]

Is it gritty when you open it or its not not easy to flip?

Not gritty at all. I just got home and I'm planning on putting a drop of oil on the bearings to see what that does, after I get done playing with the new Manix S110V I just got in the mail!

Sounds like its mostly skill related, combined perhaps with a touch too tight pivot, if the pivot was cranked down it would feel gritty or like it was grinding. It takes a while to learn to flip a specific knife, combined with the knife breaking in.

I loosened the pivot a tad and it's a bit easier now. It's been getting better all day and I'm guessing it's my technique is getting better although I do think this model just isn't and "flippy" as I expected and there's no way around it. Like mentioned above, it's the mass of the blade (lighter than the other flipper I have) and just getting used to it in general. It's flipping good, just not real fast and it doesn't lock open every single time which is where I want to be at with this knife.

Hey dubya, I don't know what the reasons might be but I had the same experience with the few Southards I handled. Honestly, I have never been impressed with any flipper until I got the recent custom from Gayle Bradley. I don't really know exactly what he did engineering/physics wise to that design but it is really incredible in its function. FWIW, the blade on that knife is very thinly ground and quite light and it still flips open effortlessly. I think blade mass is only important to compensate for something else that isn't just right in the action. It is interesting that some others have Southards that flip beautifully. That leads me to believe that it is not a physics issue with the design. Could it be a result of too much lockbar tension?? I dunno.

Custom GB? Do tell.

I just got me a Southard and it was very hard to flip for the first couple of days. As soon as my Sketchen scale gets here I will oil and mess with the pivot to see if it helps.

It has gotten better the more I flipped it but not great. Seems the detent is very strong.

I'm not positive but I feel like a strong detent is good for a flipper. It seems like if it takes a bit of force the better/faster it will flip but I really don't know.

[HarleyXJGuy]

Is it gritty when you open it or its not not easy to flip?

Not gritty at all. I just got home and I'm planning on putting a drop of oil on the bearings to see what that does, after I get done playing with the new Manix S110V I just got in the mail!

Sounds like its mostly skill related, combined perhaps with a touch too tight pivot, if the pivot was cranked down it would feel gritty or like it was grinding. It takes a while to learn to flip a specific knife, combined with the knife breaking in.

I loosened the pivot a tad and it's a bit easier now. It's been getting better all day and I'm guessing it's my technique is getting better although I do think this model just isn't and "flippy" as I expected and there's no way around it. Like mentioned above, it's the mass of the blade (lighter than the other flipper I have) and just getting used to it in general. It's flipping good, just not real fast and it doesn't lock open every single time which is where I want to be at with this knife.

Hey dubya, I don't know what the reasons might be but I had the same experience with the few Southards I handled. Honestly, I have never been impressed with any flipper until I got the recent custom from Gayle Bradley. I don't really know exactly what he did engineering/physics wise to that design but it is really incredible in its function. FWIW, the blade on that knife is very thinly ground and quite light and it still flips open effortlessly. I think blade mass is only important to compensate for something else that isn't just right in the action. It is interesting that some others have Southards that flip beautifully. That leads me to believe that it is not a physics issue with the design. Could it be a result of too much lockbar tension?? I dunno.

Custom GB? Do tell.

I just got me a Southard and it was very hard to flip for the first couple of days. As soon as my Sketchen scale gets here I will oil and mess with the pivot to see if it helps.

It has gotten better the more I flipped it but not great. Seems the detent is very strong.

I'm not positive but I feel like a strong detent is good for a flipper. It seems like if it takes a bit of force the better/faster it will flip but I really don't know.

Yes, a good amount of decent is good for a flipper.

Mine was to much though. Almost impossible to open with the spydie hole.

Since I put a new scale on it, oiled it and used it some it seems much better. Could just be technique of course.

Still seems a bit hard to unlock. Not unusable but nowhere near as easy as my Millie's liner lock.

[jabba359]

It is interesting that some others have Southards that flip beautifully. That leads me to believe that it is not a physics issue with the design. Could it be a result of too much lockbar tension?? I dunno.

My blade rotates freely with the lock depressed, but isn't the best flipper. It flips into locking position about 75% of the time (with no wrist flick to help). I think the lockbar tension on mine is putting a little too much pressure on the blade, so it doesn't open easy enough.

[Evil D]

It is interesting that some others have Southards that flip beautifully. That leads me to believe that it is not a physics issue with the design. Could it be a result of too much lockbar tension?? I dunno.

My blade rotates freely with the lock depressed, but isn't the best flipper. It flips into locking position about 75% of the time (with no wrist flick to help). I think the lockbar tension on mine is putting a little too much pressure on the blade, so it doesn't open easy enough.

Put a small dab of grease on the detent ball.

[RadioactiveSpyder]

I've been through 5 Southards now: 4 browns and 1 black. When I first got the black one, I was amazed how much smoother it operated than my first release brown Southard I picked up right after they premiered. I then had the chance to get a brand new brown one a few months back for a Ketchen scale mod and that one was WAY better than my first one: action was tremendously better, much nicer and sharper edge, and the finish was the mirror polish one that I first saw on the Slysz Bowie (meaning I think it's a standard finish for Taichung now, yay!). It locked up perfectly and released without a single hitch. Now that beauty made my first brown one look kind of pale in comparison, so I sold it off and bought another new brown one (for the same price even, another yay!). Now that one (same date code) did not quite have the same mirror finish and it had a wicked lock stick issue, so much I sent it back to the vendor for a replacement. Now #4 came in, nice enough mirror finish and a tiny bit of lock stick, but it is what it is. Still compared to the black one and that first 2015 brown one I bought that are both perfect specimens, the new replacement (#4) is about at 90% of optimal.

Not sure where I was going with this, but they are definitely hit and miss in my book to get yourself a "100-percenter" perfect action example. For the price though, you should definitely send it in to either Spyderco or return it, because when you get one that operates perfectly, you'll get why folks love them. Are they perfect flippers, no, I think the Domino does a better job actually. Maybe Lance can let me borrow his GB flipper so I can test that too!