sal wrote:Thanx for the input. I told Annika to make them 62-63, but I thought to check with my "consultant steel junky's".
Thanx for the input Cliff. Our heat treater is a metallurgist. I'll share your info with him.
I plan to put it in a Millie Jim. Mostly because I wanted one in 52100 as a work knife on the mountain. I figured you and Joe would probably want one as well. So we have 3. We'll make 1000. It was a real PITA to find it rolled to the thickness wanted. It's also a bugger to work with in a production environment. Not too many production folders out there in 52100. I can see why.
sal
I'll be keeping my eyes open for this one. 52100 Millie sounds nice.
Any news on the Millie 2? It's been discussed for a while now but haven't heard anything recent. I get iffy buying new Millies because I'm waiting for the re-design to drop. After seeing how much you improved the Para, I'm confident the Millie 2 is going to make me want to retire all my original Militarys.
dogrunner wrote:Mili in 52100 - Yes!
Great steel for a hard working knife. The 52100 blades I have, including the Mule, are all fixed blades.
Would prefer G10 by far! Ti is more expensive and heavier. Spyderco G10 is a very durable, grippy handle that is very useable in cold temps where Ti or any metal handle sucks the heat out of my hand even through mittens. Plus, one of the great features of the Mili is the amount of cutting edge you get at a light and easy carry weight. I have no problem with heavier folders (Tuff is one of my favorites), but this is the Mili!
Color - don't care at all. Prefer something different than other milis.
Great news! So, when is this going to happen :)
I find TI to not be especially thermal conductive. I've had even g10 burn my hand before but TI hasn't so far.
Just out of curiousity was that spyderco peel-ply G10 or the smooth polished G10 found on a lot of fixed blades? I ask because I have found them feel quite different in cold temps. The Ti isn't bad on a folder that has been in a pocket, but gets pretty cold when left out. Depends on temps too. My biggest problem with knife handles at temps below 0F is exposed tangs on fixed blades (steel, of course). That gets painful.
Sorry I'm late to this thread. This question feels a lot like the old blues master asking the audience if they have any requests. People keep shouting out his old great songs until he hears the one he wanted to play in the first place.
dogrunner wrote:Mili in 52100 - Yes!
Great steel for a hard working knife. The 52100 blades I have, including the Mule, are all fixed blades.
Would prefer G10 by far! Ti is more expensive and heavier. Spyderco G10 is a very durable, grippy handle that is very useable in cold temps where Ti or any metal handle sucks the heat out of my hand even through mittens. Plus, one of the great features of the Mili is the amount of cutting edge you get at a light and easy carry weight. I have no problem with heavier folders (Tuff is one of my favorites), but this is the Mili!
Color - don't care at all. Prefer something different than other milis.
Great news! So, when is this going to happen :)
I find TI to not be especially thermal conductive. I've had even g10 burn my hand before but TI hasn't so far.
Just out of curiousity was that spyderco peel-ply G10 or the smooth polished G10 found on a lot of fixed blades? I ask because I have found them feel quite different in cold temps. The Ti isn't bad on a folder that has been in a pocket, but gets pretty cold when left out. Depends on temps too. My biggest problem with knife handles at temps below 0F is exposed tangs on fixed blades (steel, of course). That gets painful.
Dang man, you go out in subzero temperatures long enough to freeze steel without gloves on? I'm getting soft in my old age.
They who dance are thought mad by those who do not hear the music.
Mike Blue wrote:Sorry I'm late to this thread. This question feels a lot like the old blues master asking the audience if they have any requests. People keep shouting out his old great songs until he hears the one he wanted to play in the first place.
My vote is Rc 60 in Bainite.
Haha, yeah, kind of. But to be fair, even the old blues master might be open minded if the entire crowd were clamoring for a good song that had not occurred to him.
Was recently trying to find a Cruwear as well but if I won't this will be a great Military user as well. (only have a CE Mili, no PE yet)
Unfortunately don't have any experience with Cruwear yet.
Dang man, you go out in subzero temperatures long enough to freeze steel without gloves on? I'm getting soft in my old age.
Not without gloves on. That's crazy talk :)
Winter is too long to stay cooped up indoors :) It gets cold here in winter. We sometimes have periods when the high temp does not get above 0F. You learn how to dress... The older Norwegian settlers said "there is no such thing as too cold, just inappropriately dressed." Their descendants are often not quite that mentally prepared (most people just complain).
My wife and I have adapted. We also use a LOT of handwarmers (in both mittens and muks). She actually handles the cold better than I do.
Dogrunner = running dogs = mushing. My wife and I have a sled team, she drives, I do chores :)
Our dogs are most comfortable at temps below 0F. They overheat above 30F when they have full-winter coats.
To get back on-topic, sort of, I place a lot of value in a knife I can handle without taking my gloves / mittens off. And yes, exposed metal can be felt through insulation that is not so thick you can't use tools anyway! As much as I like compression locks, the Mili and its liner lock or just a backlock Endura are easier to use with gloves on, so the Mili gets the call over my PM2s. Those two have long enough handles that I don't worry quite so much about hand placement when my hands are cold and covered.
Last edited by dogrunner on Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Joris Mo wrote:Was recently trying to find a Cruwear as well but if I won't this will be a great Military user as well. (only have a CE Mili, no PE yet)
Unfortunately don't have any experience with Cruwear yet.
Unfortunately indeed.Try BBS for both Manix and Milie in CPM-Cruwear.I bought both from them.Once you use cruwear you won't look back.Good luck !
we've been using this in the aerospace world for hollow-centred bevel gears and valve bodies for a good long while- the normal heat-treat is a simple oil-quench as it's not ultimate hardness that we are after- 60-61HRC is the normal target, much more and we suffer brittle failure in the gear teeth and problems in subsequent machining steps.
We also plug-quench into hot oil on ring gears....again, no more than 62HRC is the optimum for our purposes, but these are fairly thick sections (2" section)
Of course- that means nothing from a knife blade and edge retention perspective, but I thought you might be interested....The wall thickness of our bevel gears is only 3-5mm.
Warhammer 40000 is- basically- Lord Of The Rings on a cocktail of every drug known to man and genuine lunar dust, stuck in a blender with Alien, Mechwarrior, Dune, Starship Troopers, Fahrenheit 451 and Star Wars, bathed in blood, turned up to eleventy billion, set on fire, and catapulted off into space screaming "WAAAGH!" and waving a chainsaw sword- without the happy ending.
I really have enjoyed every knife I've had in this steel with some maybe a little more than others. That's subjective and I can't point out test results or reasons why it would be so. It's a rare thing to buy a knife and know the exact details of the heat treat. There are a lot of real good reasons details like that are kept in house and not published. Even publishing hardness figures can cause headaches.
The reason I recommended not going above rc 62 isn't the feeling that the steel or heat treater can't do it. I know better. I have one experience with this steel at high hardness micro chipping( maybe I need a better term for this)when a person I know used too much pressure on a round ceramic sharpening rod. I figure that person was pressing too hard and then some and it made me feel slightly careful thinking there are always folks that hear how great a particular steel is and then complain when they do something they shouldn't while claiming it couldn't be their fault. Heck, on BF a guy swore his expensive folder blade snapped in half when he just wiped the blade off on his pants leg. We've seen strange things and we only know one side of every story.
Maybe I'm too cynical, too prone to jump to conclusions where I shouldn't but apparently I do anyways. I know 52100 at c 62-63 would work fine for me and most of us here. I should probably leave it at that. This is yet another case of seeing Spyderco going where others haven't and I'm really happy about that. I can't say surprised anymore after seeing 20 years of Spyderco industry firsts. Like any other product some will love it, and some will not. Love it or not it's the only game in town quite like this . No one does it like Spyderco and sometimes no one does it but Spyderco!
The Mastiff wrote:I really have enjoyed every knife I've had in this steel with some maybe a little more than others. That's subjective and I can't point out test results or reasons why it would be so. It's a rare thing to buy a knife and know the exact details of the heat treat. There are a lot of real good reasons details like that are kept in house and not published. Even publishing hardness figures can cause headaches.
The reason I recommended not going above rc 62 isn't the feeling that the steel or heat treater can't do it. I know better. I have one experience with this steel at high hardness micro chipping( maybe I need a better term for this)when a person I know used too much pressure on a round ceramic sharpening rod. I figure that person was pressing too hard and then some and it made me feel slightly careful thinking there are always folks that hear how great a particular steel is and then complain when they do something they shouldn't while claiming it couldn't be their fault. Heck, on BF a guy swore his expensive folder blade snapped in half when he just wiped the blade off on his pants leg. We've seen strange things and we only know one side of every story.
Maybe I'm too cynical, too prone to jump to conclusions where I shouldn't but apparently I do anyways. I know 52100 at c 62-63 would work fine for me and most of us here. I should probably leave it at that. This is yet another case of seeing Spyderco going where others haven't and I'm really happy about that. I can't say surprised anymore after seeing 20 years of Spyderco industry firsts. Like any other product some will love it, and some will not. Love it or not it's the only game in town quite like this . No one does it like Spyderco and sometimes no one does it but Spyderco!
Joe
Joe,
I think it will be fine. :)
I am sure Spyderco will get the HT dialed in to do exactly what they want in their target range. :)
Being it's a Military and that's considered a slicer and not something most people would take a hammer to. :D
sbaker345 wrote:It should be fine at 62 if HT was right. If it was ran soft you'd lose any benefit to 52100
Agreed. If guys don't experience problems with something like S30V at 58-59, then I'd bet 52100 could be run at more like 63-64 with few complaints. 65 to live dangerously and 61-62 to be safe. I'd hope 60 and below wouldn't be an option. This is assuming the hardening was done as well as can be expected in a mass production run. Though I really wouldn't mind trying it out at 65. Maybe in a mule run one day?
They who dance are thought mad by those who do not hear the music.
Their descendants are often not quite that mentally prepared (most people just complain).
