Knifeworks M4 PM2!

[jimmyjohnjohn]

Given the demand, it's a fair price.

[Surfingringo]

Also a little surprised by the price.

It's not ridiculous but seems a litte much. That will be what it sells for or usual Spyderc type MSRP?

Yep, I'm with you and a bit disappointed. I'm a big fan of KW but I had to pass on the yo2 exclusive because of the pricing and I might have to pass on this one too. I've never been much of a collector so paying more than double for a pm2 in a different steel (though arguably my favorite steel) is a bit steep. We will see.

[Lost]

The secondary market prices on the previous sprint run/exclusive PM2's kinda showed KW they would be able to raise the price and everyone would still buy them. Prices will continue to rise if we continue to pay it.

[Surfingringo]

The s90v Yojimbo 2 is still available...as is the bbs s90v military. Will they squickly sell a 1200 piece run for $240? Yeah, probably. I like how KW does business so I hope this thing blows off the shelves at $240. I never begrudge anyone for making a profit. This is America after all. :). My only point is that there is a limit to what the masses will pay. Crossing that invisible line can mean the difference between selling out in a day and sitting on inventory for a couple of years.

Edit: I am not at all implying that KW has crossed that line, just discussing what I have observed about the pricing of these exclusives.

[jimmyjohnjohn]

The PM2 is probably the most popular knife in the world right now. The Yojimbo 2 is probably not one of Spyderco's most popular models. That will explain the difference you will see in how fast the M4 PM2 will sell out versus the CF S90v Yojimbo.

[Liquid Cobra]

Agreed Lance. If the BBS S90V Military was $200 I'd be enjoying one right now. Price is important and that invisible line is very real.

[nirvanero]

The s90v Yojimbo 2 is still available...as is the bbs s90v military. Will they squickly sell a 1200 piece run for $240? Yeah, probably. I like how KW does business so I hope this thing blows off the shelves at $240. I never begrudge anyone for making a profit. This is America after all. :). My only point is that there is a limit to what the masses will pay. Crossing that invisible line can mean the difference between selling out in a day and sitting on inventory for a couple of years.

Edit: I am not at all implying that KW has crossed that line, just discussing what I have observed about the pricing of these exclusives.

Very good point. KW exclusives used to be much less expensive than others' so I guess they just thought they could get closer to that line...

[senorsquare]

The s90v Yojimbo 2 is still available...as is the bbs s90v military. Will they squickly sell a 1200 piece run for $240? Yeah, probably. I like how KW does business so I hope this thing blows off the shelves at $240. I never begrudge anyone for making a profit. This is America after all. :). My only point is that there is a limit to what the masses will pay. Crossing that invisible line can mean the difference between selling out in a day and sitting on inventory for a couple of years.

Edit: I am not at all implying that KW has crossed that line, just discussing what I have observed about the pricing of these exclusives.

At $240 they are giving about a 25% discount off of the MSRP which is listed as $319.95. I guess my question would be why the big jump in suggested retail? If I recall correctly, a bunch of the recent PM2 sprints and exclusives had an MSRP around $190-$200, (I guess the exception would be the the S90V/CPM154 composite model, but that is a whole other beast right there.) Still, $320 seems like a considerable jump in price. Is there something about this particular CF or perhaps the M4 that is driving the price up? Or maybe it's just simple pricing according to market demand? It will be interesting to see how this run shakes out.

[Brock O Lee]

...My only point is that there is a limit to what the masses will pay. Crossing that invisible line can mean the difference between selling out in a day and sitting on inventory for a couple of years....

I see myself as a person who is prepared to pay more for a pocket knife than the unwashed masses :), but at $240 Knifeworks is getting very close to that invisible line for me... I certainly want one of these, but in the end it is just another PM2, and I have a few PM2 sprint users already. This version will not be miles 'better' than any of them. At this price I start to think about all the other knives on the shopping list.

If I was a collector or did not have a super steel sprint yet it would have been a whole different story...

Time will tell. If I think about this rationally it's a 'No', but sprint fever is a funny old thing... :o

[tvenuto]

The whole pricing thing is a double edged sword, to use the saying. I thought the Green 204p exclusive was an absolute steal at $150...and so did everyone else. They sold out incredibly fast, and immediately fetched $180+ on the secondary market. This would indicate that they were under-priced initially. Now you might say, "yea that's cool, it just gives us 'in the know' folks a chance to get them cheaper." However, the more under-priced the knife is, the more incentive it gives people to buy as many as they can and flip them later. So KW put up the money for someone else to come in on the back end with absolutely no risk and "middle man out" some profit.

I think pricing these higher has two main benefits. First, (more of) the profit stays with the dealer who commissioned the run. Yes they sell out slower, and I'm not privy to the economics of volume retail, but I imagine making 25% more money is worth something taking 6-8 months to sell out. Secondly, it ensures you'll be able to buy the knife from the original retailer, not a middleman who happens to be on the computer at the right time.

Of course, it's very difficult to say where the "invisible line" is, but I say there are only positives to getting as close to the line as possible. To argue for staying well below the line is to argue for a larger group of middle men who took no risk and offer no additional value (save storing the physical knife) yet profit off of the run.

Edit: I'll even call myself out here. On the Green KW run I bought two because I knew I could sell the other one off later if I didn't feel like I wanted it. I ended up keeping the better of the two, and selling off the other at a modest profit, cause hey, why not make 30 bucks? On the other hand, I only bought one CF yojimbo (at the original $230) because it was much more expensive and I didn't think it would be as saleable later (same with the Manix XL). So the result was KW got to sell that other one that I didn't buy because they remained in stock. I guess it's Karma that jumping on the PM2 made me about as much as I lost by jumping on the Yojimbo (it went on sale later).

[Donut]

One to use as-is, one to put custom scales on and use, and two to keep NIB.

Hey man, unless someone else has, I call dibs on the spare CF scales. :D

[Donut]

Did the last run of the M390's and Elmax go for $220ish? Carbon Fiber typically adds $30-40 to the street price. I think it's reasonable. I would rather have had a M4/G-10 for $200, but I can deal with a slightly higher price.

I knew the carbon fiber was going to add quite a bit of price to this.

Honestly, I don't know if the secondary market is going to offer that much more for Carbon Fiber scales, so it might not be as investment ready as the new S90V Military. If you plan on future value, you could get the M4 Para, but I wouldn't expect it to double in price. You might get an extra $100 out of it if you're lucky or sell it instantly on Ebay.

[Brock O Lee]

I agree Tvenuto, was just typing more or less the same reply while you posted yours.

[Brock O Lee]

Did the last run of the M390's and Elmax go for $220ish?

I bought a PM2 M390 for $180 in Jan 2012. CF M390 Military was $230 in Mar 2012.

$240 for this one is expensive, but with all the hype around the PM2 probably not overly so IMO.

My biggest problem is the exchange rate to my local currency. The same knife at the same USD value now costs me twice as much as in 2011.

So how would you feel about this one at $480 + $50 shipping + 15% import taxes? :o

[SpeedHoles]

^ Ouch, that would hurt!

As it is, at $240usd, this would be the most expensive knife I have ever purchased. :eek:

[Donut]

Did the last run of the M390's and Elmax go for $220ish?

I bought a PM2 M390 for $180 in Jan 2012. CF M390 Military was $230 in Mar 2012.

$240 for this one is expensive, but with all the hype around the PM2 probably not overly so IMO.

My biggest problem is the exchange rate to my local currency. The same knife at the same USD value now costs me twice as much as in 2011.

So how would you feel about this one at $480 + $50 shipping + 15% import taxes? :o

See, I think the later runs of the M390 Para were more expensive than the first run.

I also bought one for $180.

[GoldenSpydie]

Hey man, unless someone else has, I call dibs on the spare CF scales. :D

If I decide to get rid of them, you've got them.

this would be the most expensive knife I have ever purchased. :eek:

You've got to break your records sometime... :D

[PayneTrain]

Hmm, this complicates things. I was not expecting it to be that much. Must be the carbon fiber. Now I'm really not sure, but thankfully I have the better part of a year to think about it.

It sure makes the green Military look like a **** of a value!

[bdblue]

Hmm, this complicates things. I was not expecting it to be that much. Must be the carbon fiber.

I can't find a way to rationalize the price. The Bradley folder has M4 and Carbon Fiber, with a street price of about $145. The plain satin/black Para2 has a street price of about $105. Put both of those knives together and you barely exceed the price for the new exclusive.

The same could be said for the previous Manix 2 XL exclusive, and it took awhile for those to sell. However the Para2 sells like magic so the price probably won't be a problem. It might keep them from selling out in hours which will help the enthusiasts that really want them and can afford the price.

[senorsquare]

Did the last run of the M390's and Elmax go for $220ish?

I bought a PM2 M390 for $180 in Jan 2012. CF M390 Military was $230 in Mar 2012.

$240 for this one is expensive, but with all the hype around the PM2 probably not overly so IMO.

My biggest problem is the exchange rate to my local currency. The same knife at the same USD value now costs me twice as much as in 2011.

So how would you feel about this one at $480 + $50 shipping + 15% import taxes? :o

See, I think the later runs of the M390 Para were more expensive than the first run.

I also bought one for $180.

My first M390 para was $179, the next run was $189 if I remember correctly.